Quote from Transitioned on February 14, 2023, 12:40 am

Bit rushed just a quick note.  I think you did amazing.  Really tough situation.  First you would have been blindsided.  Happy event and you had no idea this girl had been festering.  And she obviously is a master at playing the victim card and assembling a lynch mob.  Also quite impressed with your male friends that there was no dick white knighting from anyone.  Whole thing is so over the top it would be interesting to know if she is normally a drama queen.

Quote from Ali Scarlett on February 14, 2023, 3:29 am

Hey John,

Sorry to hear you had to deal with that on your birthday.

Honestly, it almost came across to me like she might've been somewhat romantically interested in you based on the way she was acting (and I'll expand on that a little more later). However, I could be wrong.

Quote from John Freeman on February 13, 2023, 8:34 pm

Event

The night was going well. We had great fun, people were singing karaoke dressed as glam rock stars. To be social, I went to her to ask her how she was and this is how it went:

Her: I don't like karaoke

Me: Well, that's why I prepared a playlist for after the karaoke so people who don't like karaoke can dance

Her: Well it's your birthday, you can stop the karaoke now so we can dance

Me (looking at the crowd singing their lungs out and having the time of their life): So you're trying to influence me so you can dance now? No, I'm not going to do that, people are having great fun!

Her: You and I we never got along together anyway.

Me (really puzzled and confused): what do you mean?

Her: well, you know you remember, we had this talk...

Me (searching my memory): I don't remember...

Her: Yeah it was at your sister's birthday 2 years ago

Me (searching even harder my memory): I'm sorry I don't remember at all

Her: Yeah you know we had this conversation about hospitals and you were being a dick

Me (changing to serious tone): Well, stop insulting me, I'm going to go outside anyway. Talk to you later. (as warm smile as I could)

Asking how someone is doing as the host of the party can be a "checking up on you" power move that further shows your leadership.

So, more than being social, it's also a way of being leaderlike and, since it seems like you were being quite value-giving, I feel like it was a great move.

That's a part of why her response, "I don't like karaoke," would've taken me aback a bit.

And, I think you made another great move in response to that too. Rather than viewing it as a normal comment and changing the subject (such as by asking, "Yeah, it's not for everyone, so what kinds of things do you like?" which would've been a good option, but might've cost you leadership points), you continue the host role/leadership frame by offering her an alternative way to enjoy the party: dancing.

Then, she says:

Her: "Well it's your birthday, you can stop the karaoke now so we can dance."

At first, I was confused.

Then, when I realized what she was saying, I thought she was a bit crazy (which might've been further validated by the following events of the story :).

My response might've been:

Ali: "Yeah (agree), maybe later (the "maybe" means "I'll think about it which I can do because it's ultimately my decision" and the "later" rejects her request while still leaving the door open for her to get what she wants in the future), it seems like people are enjoying the music right now (refuses her "we" frame that "they all" would rather dance), so I'll wait (ends by firmly reminding her it's your choice)."

The firmness at the end is warranted to me given her rudeness.

However, your response led to a negative downward spiral because of a mistake I've made before too: not helping people save face.

Asshole behavior is asshole behavior and, sometimes, especially when one is angry/upset, we can feel more like just calling it for what it is. But, that can lead to a negative outcome if we're not careful.

John: [Looks at the crowd singing their lungs out and having the time of their life] "So, you're trying to influence me (calls out her game bluntly) so you can dance now? No, I'm not going to do that, people are having great fun!"

The "influence me" part came across as "you're trying to manipulate me" to me given the context and the way it might've been said.

That's why, rather than focus on the point of what she actually wanted (which was to dance), she then switches gears to you and her:

Her: "You and I, we never got along together anyway."

Of course, I could be wrong on this, and since you were there, you would know better than I would.

The "together" sounded (to me) like she was saying "we never worked out", a bit like she might've wanted something in the past, but there were too many disagreements.

I think it's great that you asked for clarification and then searched your brain for what might've happened (and, in your shoes, after how rude she was, I wouldn't have apologized without knowing/remembering exactly what happened either).

Then, she takes it too far, in my opinion:

Her: "Yeah, you know, we had this conversation about hospitals and you were being a dick."

John: [Changes to a serious tone] "Well, stop insulting me, I'm going to go outside anyway. Talk to you later [gives as warm of a smile as he can]."

The "stop insulting me" wasn't ideal because it:

• Was unspecific: better might've been to point out that you don't appreciate being called names but, more importantly, it
• Refuses to address her issue: which is why she later starts following you in search of a resolution (albeit in a crazy manner, I'll admit, and it felt to me like there was more to it than that)

So, another option might've been:

Her: "Yeah, you know, we had this conversation about hospitals and you were being a dick."

John: "Look, Aurora, I don't remember what happened, but I don't appreciate being called names. And, if you want to talk about it, I'd be happy to, but I don't think this is the best timing. It's my birthday, I want to have a good time and, as a matter of fact, I want you to have a good time too. So, let's talk about this tomorrow."

Continuing forward, she starts following you.

The way she re-opens the conversation makes it seem like she wants to start trouble:

Her: "But yeah remember you were being a dick."

But, it also makes it seem (to me) like she's trying to get a reaction out of you now (since you just said to stop insulting you).

What's odd is her persistence despite having come to the party with her friend, who you'd think she'd be more concerned about spending time with.

Instead, she'd rather be chasing you.

Especially here:

John: "Well, I don't want to talk with you, leave me alone (John could not have put it more bluntly)."

Her: [Comes closer]

It's as if she wants to know that you care about her—it's crossing into emotional validation-seeking territory for me. A potentially telling factor for me is that you didn't say she was yelling/screaming at you which would probably make the chasing a more emotional decision than a rational one. It seems as if she knows exactly what she's doing and is choosing to do it anyway.

Albeit, I could definitely be reading too far into things, and happy to hear if you disagree.

Still, it's like an episode of The Bachelor, maybe you got the ladies goin' crazy, John, you never know :).

All jokes aside, let's take a look at this part now:

John: "You know your friends just insulted me?"

John's Sister: [To Aurora] "You insulted my brother?"

Maybe this was a typo, but I would've said your "friend" over "friends" since it avoids making enemies of your sister's entire friend group.

And, maybe re-worded it differently:

John: "[Sister's Name], your friend keeps following me and she's not listening to me, so I'd like you to talk to her."

This way it doesn't seems like you're "running to your sister" to handle it for you (which can make it seem like she has the real authority/more power), you're asking for her to help you resolve it (which is more win-win).

Then, the drama show, the attempt at an Oscar, and the victim-playing ensues and, again, this part stands out to me:

John: "For me it all started when you said, 'You and I we never got along together.'"

Her: "I never said that."

She lies, yes, but I'm also wondering why she lied.

It could be that she's a bit crazy, maybe.

But, it could also be that she didn't want to let your sister on to the fact that she might've been into her brother at one point. Or, maybe more realistically, that you've never had a good relationship (and maybe she was even pretending everything was good?).

Then, on the last part, I would've ignored the social pressure of the group asking you to go talk to her. It's your choice and you can walk away (especially on your birthday of all days):

The Girl Group: "Come on, talk to her!"

John: "I'll talk to her later, I'm upset right now."

And, being honest about your feelings would still be an assertive way to go (while avoiding putting on a mask of being cool with the situation, which I don't know many who would be).

I like your friend's advice not to let her stay over at your house.

To me, that would be the equivalent of rewarding bad behavior.

She comes over, disrespects you repeatedly, and in response you buy her a mattress and let her stay the night at your place?

No, by punishing her poor behavior, you send a strong message that you didn't appreciate it and give yourself a better chance of making progress with her (if that's something you want).

Quote from Lucio Buffalmano on February 14, 2023, 6:04 am

This is proper "BOOOM" stuff, John.

The talk with the bar owner was the "jedi" turning point, and the final resolution of "not staying at my place" + "leave" was perfect.

2h of anger but with a fantastic turnaround and a lifetime of learning, it sounds like a great deal to me -you'd almost have to thank that crazy woman :)-.

For the sake of learning, to go back and do anything differently, I may have:

• Cut the initial interaction short: one you see she's a value-taking witch, move sooner. The more time and more investment you give her, the more opportunities she has to take value.
  Her very first sentence was already a major red flag. The second one was the confirmation that this was going to be a slippery slope of nastiness
• Stand your ground once you're outside: while moving to your friends is not too bad so that people can see that she's the one following you, it's still not very high power (plus, they may still wonder "why is she following him, has he done anything bad to her?").
  Instead, stand your ground, raise your hand in a "stop" sign and say "please go" "I don't want talk to you" "please go" and then just cycle and repeat the same

Overall, this is a great story to me.

Quote from John Freeman on February 14, 2023, 6:25 am

Thank you very much, guys! I'll answer properly later.

Quick comment: hahaha, yeah it definitely felt Jedi-like! ("these are not the droids you're looking for"). Being a bar owner for 8 years, he learned some solid frame control to deal with drunk people. You can sit and watch him talk with and engage the customers and you just learn frame control.

And regarding the witch (one meta-comment: I think you really are a very intuitive person, generally speaking). She really is like a witch: she has the hair of a witch and the behavior of a witch. If I had one word to describe it that would be it. She has clear big blue eyes, semi wavy-semi straight raven haired falling on the shoulders, a weird forced smile, and her posture and body reminds me of this guy: