Former Community – We Moved
🆕 Coached community here, for posts & feedback public community here.
How to counter the "Get Denied to Get Rid" power move
I must admit that I've been on the losing end of the "get denied to get rid" of power move in very specific dating context. I will make plans with a woman with "gold digger" tendencies to, for example, have dinner. At the last minute she says that the city is "too hot" in summer, and states that unless I plan a weekend getaway at the beach, she's going to cancel our date.
When this happens, it is painfully obvious that she is not really interested in me and wants to get rid of me.
This is very bad for 2 reasons:
1) Even if I had unlimited resources to instantly fly her to her destination of choice on a private jet, she would join me and have sex with me. But on some level she wouldn't truly respect me because I would still be bending to her frame, albeit in a high value way that makes it a little less pathetic, but still pathetic.
2) If I state that I am unable to provide what she is asking for, I look like a weak loser.
There's no way to turn this situation around and make her fall in love with me when this happens. But what can I do to reclaim some power in this situation? What can I say or do to avoid being "the biggest loser" when this happens?
Hey Ed,
A few options:
- Tell her you'll fly indeed... But the weekend after that
A bit of gamenship there.
First of all, you do not accept her frame 100%, because you pretend that you were going to fly anyway, and the weekend after. So if she agrees with that, she is also partly bending to your schedule.
Once you go on the date, you have some "material" leverage, so to speak.
If she wants to fly with you, she must be on her good behavior, which might put some pressure on her for sex.
- Fly with her and bang her
If you have sex with her on that trip and then stop spending anything on her, it can be a fair deal.
That's how some men of good income live.
They make themselves little qualms about investing as little as possible or showing their best side and treat women like temporary rental properties.
They fly them around, spend some money on them, have some good time together, and then goodbye.
The not-cool, low-value way it is to treat her like a queen, fall in love with her, and beg her.
The cool way of doing it is to have a carefree approach to money and see women as fun, interchangeable objects.
Some guys enjoy that lifestyle.
It's not how I personally date, it's not how I recommend entering long-term relationships, but it's a fair choice and an exchange that can make both happy.
- Invest on her, bang her, then disappear
After sex happens there is a resurgence of power from the man, so if you invest a bit more than you're happy to but then bang her and then you want to "even the scores", it's a possibility.
That's not the type of girl you and relationship you might want to take to the altar, but if you really want to sex and it becomes a "spend to date me game", you can spend until sex... And then take a little revenge when you treat her like second or third fiddle.
I never recommend of treating people poorly... Unless they behave in a way that makes poor treatment "called for".
This might be one such situation.
- Be ready to lose her, and go full-out power
Games of chicken are games where you put the relationship on the line.
If she rejects them, then it goes nowhere.
If she accepts, your power goes up 100x.
Since you have very little leverage before any real dating has happened, chances are she will reject the. But you don't lose anything.
For example:
Her: the city is too hot. Are you planning a weekend getaway at the beach? If not, I might have to cancel going to cancel our date.
You: you seemed a cool girl, but I'm having to rethink now. I expect an apology for that kind of tone if we are having to enjoy a meal
She might not apologize, in which case, fine.
This is possibly the option I'd personally go for.
- Games of chicken bartering
Example:
Her: the city is too hot. Are you planning a weekend getaway at the beach? If not, I might have to cancel going to cancel our date.
You: that depends. Are you planning to wear edible underwear (or whatever you like)?
She is asking you for a future material benefit.
You ask for a sexually-related benefit before that.
If you think about it, much of the leverage is still on your side.
You have spent nothing, and you are talking about a future benefit. If you have sex after that date, which your message implies, the power is all on your side.
Chances are she might not reply, and that's OK.
If she says no or plays some Madonna games pretending to be shocked, you stick to your guns.
Great answer. The part in the middle of your answer about "you seem great but I'm going to expect an apology for that tone" is especially good.
I understand your point about the "right way" to fly her around on a private jet etc, but I'm (not yet) a private jet owner so unfortunately I'm going to have to wait before I can use that tip.
The advice in the beginning re: "We can go away NEXT weekend" is ok, but it does have 2 "loopholes" in my view:
1) You have own a beach house or whatever to take her to the following weekend if you offer that. I don't own a beach house yet.
AND: If you DO own a beach house, why not take her there and have sex with her THIS weekend?
2) What do you do when she says: "You're going to the Hamptons next weekend? Great! Let's cancel our date this weekend and go to the Hamptons together when you're going there next weekend." The women in my world don't jump through hoops, and don't do anything they don't want to do to "earn" a future reward. They get what they want when they want, or they are gone.
Quote from EdnBr on July 8, 2020, 11:11 pm2) What do you do when she says: "You're going to the Hamptons next weekend? Great! Let's cancel our date this weekend and go to the Hamptons together when you're going there next weekend." The women in my world don't jump through hoops, and don't do anything they don't want to do to "earn" a future reward. They get what they want when they want, or they are gone.
You could answer with something like:
You see, my friend, I don't just take anyone to my cozy abode on the beach.
We should get to know each other first. Plus, I appreciate people who stick to their words. So: dinner later. You in?
To make it shorter, feel free to cut out the "I appreciate people who stick to their words".
Lying With Game Players: Is It Fair Game?
You don't need to own a house to say you own one.
As usual, I do not recommend lying or playing games.... Unless you are dealing with manipulative people. Then, if you don't, you are at a disadvantage.
Personally, I would not lie, not in this case.
But given the behavior you described in the beginning, which in my opinion was unethical and disrespectful, this would be a grey area in my opinion.
So if you'd go for it, then the process would be:
- Seek to have sex with her on the first date, or your lie will become apparent
- If you two like each other, then you would say "look, let me be honest, I lied about the house, BUT I lied because I thought you were being unfair with your initial games" and see how it goes. If she comes out and apologizes, you apologize too and you're back at square 1
- If the first date ends without, you would seek to meet her again before the non-existing Hamptons weekend and see if you can close the deal at that point
