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"I hope you were not vexed"

#1 · March 14, 2022, 9:45 pm

Quote from John Freeman on March 14, 2022, 9:45 pm
Hello guys,
here is something that happened to me recently that I need your help with:
Part 1
Last Sunday I proposed a friend (B. the "affectionate dominant" style) to come to his place with a few beers to watch a football game. I'm not so much into football but it was an opportunity to see my friend and relax after a day of work (I work 7 days out of 7 these days). I bought the beer and the peanuts and then realised I was too exhausted to go to his place. So I told him the truth via whatsapp. He said "no worries, I'm going to take the opportunity to clean my appartment".
Part 2
The Friday after that I called him to propose a beer on Saturday. He said sure let's get in touch to know the time and place.
Saturday he answered via WhatsApp:
Him: Hello John, this time it's my turn to cancel... Sorry, I have the opportunity to get with a chick tonight (sweat emoji)
Me (seeing it as a power move): answers something then delete the messages, corrects:
Me: Ok. That being said, this is not the same situation.
Him: No but my balls are full (laughing emoji x 3)
Then I go to a friend's place and text him:
Me: we're doing a game at F's place. See you next time!
So basically he said: I can cancel on you and go with a chick (power move). He tried to frame it as the same situation as me being exhausted, which I rejected. This is why I deleted my message and responded in a more power aware way. I think I made a mistake as my move was a bit passive aggressive. I wanted to show him that I did not need him.
Today, I call him and was friendly, we talk about 30 min on the phone. At the end he says:
Him: I hope you are not vexed. I really had a sexual urge.
Me: No I'm not. I understand.
Also, he opened the conversation with him having his balls empty now.
I think I did not handled it well. What I shall have done better:
Address in an eagle way when he cancelled on me the Saturday after he recognised it was not the same situation: "Well, you told me that we were going to have a beer and now you cancel to get with a girl. That's not a nice thing to do to a friend."
Or if I did not say that, say today:
Him: I hope you are not vexed. I really had a sexual urge.
Me: No I'm not. I understand. Next time tell me in advance so I can organise other plans.
Because if my other friend was not there, I would have been empty-handed on Saturday night. So I did improve my social life as I have options now. However I still have some power-awareness problems.
That's the frame that my friend tried to put on me a couple of time: the guy who's easily vexed. There's a bit of truth, there. I do take things personally sometimes. However, I think it's a matter of respect. I noticed that I have higher standards of respect than my current friends. So sometimes they think I'm being too serious about small stuff.
In these moments, where there is an emotion like little anger. Like I feel I got my buttons pushed, there is a power dynamics and I feel like I "lost", I think there is a change of mindset I have to make. I'm aware this thread is quite long, but it is revealing of what kind of situations puts me off balance.
Something to add: when I proposed him to have a beer together he proposed to invite a 3rd friend. So I think I'm not being valued a lot here despite all the value given. I've not been an enlightened collaborator there I think.
What do you guys think?

Hello guys,

here is something that happened to me recently that I need your help with:

Part 1

Last Sunday I proposed a friend (B. the "affectionate dominant" style) to come to his place with a few beers to watch a football game. I'm not so much into football but it was an opportunity to see my friend and relax after a day of work (I work 7 days out of 7 these days). I bought the beer and the peanuts and then realised I was too exhausted to go to his place. So I told him the truth via whatsapp. He said "no worries, I'm going to take the opportunity to clean my appartment".

Part 2

The Friday after that I called him to propose a beer on Saturday. He said sure let's get in touch to know the time and place.

Saturday he answered via WhatsApp:

Him: Hello John, this time it's my turn to cancel... Sorry, I have the opportunity to get with a chick tonight (sweat emoji)
Me (seeing it as a power move): answers something then delete the messages, corrects:
Me: Ok. That being said, this is not the same situation.
Him: No but my balls are full (laughing emoji x 3)

Then I go to a friend's place and text him:

Me: we're doing a game at F's place. See you next time!

So basically he said: I can cancel on you and go with a chick (power move). He tried to frame it as the same situation as me being exhausted, which I rejected. This is why I deleted my message and responded in a more power aware way. I think I made a mistake as my move was a bit passive aggressive. I wanted to show him that I did not need him.

Today, I call him and was friendly, we talk about 30 min on the phone. At the end he says:

Him: I hope you are not vexed. I really had a sexual urge.
Me: No I'm not. I understand.

Also, he opened the conversation with him having his balls empty now.

I think I did not handled it well. What I shall have done better:

Address in an eagle way when he cancelled on me the Saturday after he recognised it was not the same situation: "Well, you told me that we were going to have a beer and now you cancel to get with a girl. That's not a nice thing to do to a friend."

Or if I did not say that, say today:

Him: I hope you are not vexed. I really had a sexual urge.
Me: No I'm not. I understand. Next time tell me in advance so I can organise other plans.

Because if my other friend was not there, I would have been empty-handed on Saturday night. So I did improve my social life as I have options now. However I still have some power-awareness problems.

That's the frame that my friend tried to put on me a couple of time: the guy who's easily vexed. There's a bit of truth, there. I do take things personally sometimes. However, I think it's a matter of respect. I noticed that I have higher standards of respect than my current friends. So sometimes they think I'm being too serious about small stuff.

In these moments, where there is an emotion like little anger. Like I feel I got my buttons pushed, there is a power dynamics and I feel like I "lost", I think there is a change of mindset I have to make. I'm aware this thread is quite long, but it is revealing of what kind of situations puts me off balance.

Something to add: when I proposed him to have a beer together he proposed to invite a 3rd friend. So I think I'm not being valued a lot here despite all the value given. I've not been an enlightened collaborator there I think.

What do you guys think?

#2 · March 14, 2022, 10:02 pm

Hey John

this one is really on the margins to me so it's pretty much going to depend on how you see things. In other words whatever I say I am right for me and whatever you say you are right for you.

Some guys are bros before hoes but it's pretty rare. It's also a common powermove to say that to your mate and then throw them under the bus anytime you are competing for a skirt. A lot of guys are so driven by the small head that they will always place getting with a chick over anything else.

I probably would have answered yea give me a bit more notice next time.

That's the heart of the disrespect that he is not giving you time to make alternative plans.

Either way kudos for your energy levels if I was working 7 days a week I would be a hermit ☹️

And TBH I wouldn't worry about being too sensitive. You haven't cracked it here and we are pretty brutal in the bullpen. And if you are working 7 days a week that is definitely going to add to your stress levels so you need to be kind to yourself and not should on yourself. You are already in the top 5% of guys terms of being on mission and what you've achieved. It's pretty damned impressive.

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#3 · March 14, 2022, 10:06 pm

Thanks man!

I go to bed really early and wake up early. And I don't party. On Saturday and Sunday I work 2-3 hours per day for more accuracy.

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#4 · March 14, 2022, 10:28 pm

Quote from Transitioned on March 14, 2022, 10:02 pm
And TBH I wouldn't worry about being too sensitive. You haven't cracked it here and we are pretty brutal in the bullpen. And if you are working 7 days a week that is definitely going to add to your stress levels so you need to be kind to yourself and not should on yourself. You are already in the top 5% of guys terms of being on mission and what you've achieved. It's pretty damned impressive.

Thank you very much. :)

#5 · March 15, 2022, 10:59 am

Hi Guys,

my thoughts: while cancelling the meeting after you cancelled one would not be, in itself, more than a yellow level power move, it is the "I hope you are not vexed" part that is more troubling.

That's because he chose not only to "rebalance" the playing field (let's deviate for a moment from the point if he was justified or not in cancelling back, and let's say you let it slide anyways).

He deliberately chose to "push even forward" with some gaslighting (he is, after all, criticizing you for your normal emotional reaction to his move).

So my idea would be to respond with something that strikes back at him:

Him: I hope you are not vexed. I really had a sexual urge.
Me: All good, I know what a dog you are!

Or softer:

Him: I hope you are not vexed. I really had a sexual urge.
Me: All good, I know who you are!

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#6 · March 15, 2022, 11:22 am

Yeah, as Kevin says this will depend a lot on people, personalities, and relationships.

I'm going to reply to this at a general level, rather than the specific power moves -which were present here-.

In my opinion, it's fair to cancel for a date / hookup.

BUT

It depends a lot on how it's done.

It's not cool to frame it in a way that the friend ends up being framed as "lower priority".
I remember years ago when a common friend canceled on another common friend because "pussy comes first", and my friend thought it wasn't cool -and I agreed, again not because of the choice, but because of the frame and disempowerment-.

A much better way -and mindset- of going about it is "friends generally last longer, sometimes indefinitely, so they're longer-term higher priority, but short-term a date or hookup can be higher-priority because friends are longer-lasting".
Such as, it's precisely the longer-lasting and "more solid" bond of the friendship that allows the canceling.

A good friendship bond should also include that type of understanding and be cool/happy with the rescheduling (if it's well-framed and a one-off). For most of my friends I care about, I'd be happy if they had something lined up and I'd wish them well and celebrate with them if it goes well on the next available chance.

And then you communicate that very honestly with something like:

"hey man, was looking forward to meetup, and now this date has come up and she seems really cool. You're my friend and I barely know here, but if I don't date now it'll be lost probably for ever and instead we'll be friend probably for ever and can always meet.
Cool if we move it?"

And then you make it up and re-empower again with the next message and in person -maybe offering the round or something-.

Edit:
Improvements, it's better explained now.

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#7 · March 15, 2022, 6:17 pm

Quote from John Freeman on March 15, 2022, 6:17 pm
Thanks for your answer, Bel.
Definitely I could have use the second answer. It's true that he tried to make his behaviour like it was the same as mine whereas it was not. So definitely an element of manipulation here.
Thanks for your answer, Lucio.
I agree with you. It's not about the what. It's about the "how".
More context:
About 6 months ago, I invited him along with other friends for a 5 players game. He did not answer me. Then, 30 min before the meeting time he said he's coming.
I said to him: "I'm very sorry but I bought food for 5 people and prepared a 5 players games. You should have told me earlier. I would have liked for you to come :("
Because in the mean time another friend told me the day before that he was coming so his spot was gone. The truth is that B. got into an argument with his GF and this is why he changed his mind. So this was his back-up plan. I was not going to accept him just because he changed his mind at the last minute. I respected the work I put into organizing this board game night.
I apologised a week later as he was really pissed off. But I could see that he was thinking about him before thinking about me. It's fair but I decided to think about me before thinking about him. He did not care about the hours it took me to prepare the evening. It was just about him. And when he got denied he was frustrated.
Another piece of context:
For his birthday, I organised a surprise: we were supposed to "help a friend to move some furnitures". He accepted. But in truth we were going to do some karting for his birthday. Later on we went to the restaurant to meet his GF and other friends. As a surprise as well. We bought him a gift card to go see F1 racing (he loves racing). On top of that I offered him a board game. He told me that no one ever did all this for him.
So I know I bring a lot of value to my friends (because they tell me). That's why when he cancelled last minute I felt like he backtracked on our friendship. If I was in his shoes, I would have at least called and apologize, even with the same choices and actions.
So, this situation is good intel for me. That's why my next step is to expand my social circle so I don't rely on 3-5 people.
Thanks to self-development and this website, I increased my quality many fold in the last year. I was less socially savvy than the friends that I found at the beginning of this TPM journey and I felt they were higher quality than me.
Now, I'm finding that thanks to my growth I can see they're not as high quality as I expected. They're still my friends and they're still high quality. However, I think I underestimated me and over-estimated them.
This is not about bragging. If it's something, it's even more a commitment to myself to become higher quality, an eagle and higher power. It's more a testimony that when you work on yourself internally at some point you can see how your work has paid by comparison. This is also a testimony to how much more work I have to do.
Thanks for your support, guys!

Thanks for your answer, Bel.

Definitely I could have use the second answer. It's true that he tried to make his behaviour like it was the same as mine whereas it was not. So definitely an element of manipulation here.

Thanks for your answer, Lucio.

I agree with you. It's not about the what. It's about the "how".

More context:

About 6 months ago, I invited him along with other friends for a 5 players game. He did not answer me. Then, 30 min before the meeting time he said he's coming.

I said to him: "I'm very sorry but I bought food for 5 people and prepared a 5 players games. You should have told me earlier. I would have liked for you to come :("

Because in the mean time another friend told me the day before that he was coming so his spot was gone. The truth is that B. got into an argument with his GF and this is why he changed his mind. So this was his back-up plan. I was not going to accept him just because he changed his mind at the last minute. I respected the work I put into organizing this board game night.

I apologised a week later as he was really pissed off. But I could see that he was thinking about him before thinking about me. It's fair but I decided to think about me before thinking about him. He did not care about the hours it took me to prepare the evening. It was just about him. And when he got denied he was frustrated.

Another piece of context:

For his birthday, I organised a surprise: we were supposed to "help a friend to move some furnitures". He accepted. But in truth we were going to do some karting for his birthday. Later on we went to the restaurant to meet his GF and other friends. As a surprise as well. We bought him a gift card to go see F1 racing (he loves racing). On top of that I offered him a board game. He told me that no one ever did all this for him.

So I know I bring a lot of value to my friends (because they tell me). That's why when he cancelled last minute I felt like he backtracked on our friendship. If I was in his shoes, I would have at least called and apologize, even with the same choices and actions.

So, this situation is good intel for me. That's why my next step is to expand my social circle so I don't rely on 3-5 people.

Thanks to self-development and this website, I increased my quality many fold in the last year. I was less socially savvy than the friends that I found at the beginning of this TPM journey and I felt they were higher quality than me.

Now, I'm finding that thanks to my growth I can see they're not as high quality as I expected. They're still my friends and they're still high quality. However, I think I underestimated me and over-estimated them.

This is not about bragging. If it's something, it's even more a commitment to myself to become higher quality, an eagle and higher power. It's more a testimony that when you work on yourself internally at some point you can see how your work has paid by comparison. This is also a testimony to how much more work I have to do.

Thanks for your support, guys!

B has reacted to this post.