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Jordan Welch top reaction to people turning on him
Jordan Welch tried out an Andrew Tate product.
Unsurprisingly, the product sucked.
He also booked a 1:1 call with Tate and twice Tate didn't show up (also not surprising).
Since Tate is so popular these days in the manosphere, some guys on a red pill show criticized Jordan, even call him a "snitch" (you know you're a bitch when you defend your "leader" no matter what).
Welch goes on a show, and the host wanted his reaction on people turning on him.
His handling of situation is fantastic:
Host: even your boy Nico even your boy Sicko said "can I trust him or is he a snake". So yeah so it's like that's your boy. So now these red pill men influencers
are kind of... You're catching beef with them so like what and also obviously the community so like last question on that: like how does that make you feel. Friends
are even questioning you, the red pill communities coming at you (...)
Jack: No, because I don't care because you have to understand that over this last couple years I've been building a network of amazing friends all around the world so if a couple YouTubers don't love me, it doesn't change my life in any way. My family loves me my friends love me,
so I'm not hurt by fresh with the sunglasses (<----- smooth power move!)
talking about me on the stream. You know we weren't even close to begin with (<----- that guy ain't my friend, and after this high-quality reply plus the powe rmoves, the frame becomes that Fresh is below him)
Top, top answer.
Also his demeanour is fantastic.
High power body language, expressions and deliver WITHOUT coming across as overdoing it or imposing.
Really great.
Thanks. I also saw another who got ripped off from his expansive « inner circle » product (could not find the name again). He never got the coaching products he paid fort. If he speaks like a crook and behaves like a crook…
I meant « coaching calls »
Thank you for sharing this case study, Lucio! I hadn't seen Jordan Welch outside of his own YouTube channel before now and it's cool to see him handle this situation in an interview so well.
It seems like the red pill community went for the "moral judge frame" of loyalty, taking the moral high ground and trying to frame Welch as being disloyal (for "snitching").
So, another approach maybe could've been for Welch to reframe from the situation being about loyalty to being about honesty (which frames that community as supporting and encouraging dishonesty).
For example, something like:
Welch: "Look, this isn't about loyalty, it's about honesty. And the fact of the matter is that I booked a call with Tate and he didn't show. So, rather than hide that from my community which would've been lying by ommission, I chose to be honest with them and shared the good and the bad of his program. All of my friends and family are honest people who would treat their communities with that same respect and anyone who wouldn't isn't a real friend of mine.
This response puts his moral character above his opponents, self-framing him as someone who puts ethics before "friendships" with those who see honesty with their community as snitching (and I put friendships in quotations because, as Welch says himself, he wasn't really close with those guys anyway).
The only downside to this alternative (which is why I think Welch's actual response might've been better) is that it still validates those red-pill YouTubers as being worth addressing.
Welch's actual answer instead minimizes their importance and focuses on those who really matter to him: his network of amazing friends and family that he's been building over the years.
Perhaps a way of combing the two could've been the best mix. But that could've also resulted in too much effort expended on something that maybe didn't matter that much. (After all, he just hit a million subscribers last month, so whatever "beef" the host was talking about and that narrative of the red pill "coming at him" that he was trying to push might've been exaggerated because, from the outside looking in, Welch hasn't been slowing down much at all.)
That's really good, Ali.
His original format is higher power as it doesn't justify in anyway.
But your format works better for clearing his name.
Clearing his name, and also indirectly framing the others as bitches who are defending someone who, actions at hand, is indefensible.
Given how distorted that reality had become and somehow nobody even noticed that Tate was a no show for two times in a row, no justification (and possibly simply just took the money), your version is great.
The only downside is that you deepen the beef with that honest(/not honest) frame.
And he later tried to smoothen it over saying he'd be happy to talk to with Tate anyway, and he may take that feedback to improve the product (in truth, in all likelihood Tate has no intention of doing that because he doesn't care about his customers, but that's a different issue).
But then again... May have been a good opportunity for him to call it how it is and bet on a longer-term game where eventually the truth spreads a bit more, and he'd have lead early by example.
P.S.:
turned this little case study into a YouTube video, will release going forward.
Turned it into a video:
Too bad Ali's approach came after the video, or I'd have included it.
Quote from John Freeman on July 17, 2023, 5:50 pmThanks. I also saw another who got ripped off from his expansive « inner circle » product (could not find the name again). He never got the coaching products he paid fort. If he speaks like a crook and behaves like a crook…
Quoting myself. Watching your great video now. Yes that was the guy I watched the video, the name was the "war room". I was also kind of surprised: "2 guys? or is it the same guy?". It's the same guy. He did a service to the World, good man.
