Former Community – We Moved

🆕 Coached community here, for posts & feedback public community here.

ForumResources: StrategiesMachiavellianMachiavellian mistake: refusing a …

Please or Register to create posts and topics.

Machiavellian mistake: refusing a job offer

#1 · August 24, 2023, 7:32 am

Quote from John Freeman on August 24, 2023, 7:32 am
Hello TPM community,
I made a machiavellian mistake.
During my last performance review at the regional hospital I'm working in, I had a great evaluation. Staff physicians asked me if I was interested in becoming a staff physician in a regional hospital in the future. They also asked me if I was interested in having my own private practice (as an employee from the hospital). That was coming from 2 staff physicians who are going to leave soon the hospital. So it's for the future of the pediatrics department, not for their interest (high value high quality people).
Translation: "do you want to become part of the staff physician team in the future in this hospital? If yes we have a spot for you. If not you can have your own practice"
I thanked them and answered that I was more interested in being an attending physician, to do team-leading in the field. I also told them that I feel I need more experience in another hospital and/or abroad. Also I'm not interested in having my own practice as the work is not as interesting as the hospital (routine well-child visit checks, benign viral infections: lots of advice and reassurance not so much interesting diagnostics and treatment).
Indeed, staff physicians do more meetings, more paperwork and also have night shifts. They get a good salary though (250'000 euros gross a year). It's basically upper management work. So it's a great honour they did to me. Especially knowing how many critical and demeaning bosses I met before.
Until this point: fair enough. Honest straight talk from me.
However, it's still a rejection. I still bring value and all. However it could frame me as thinking "I'm too good for their offer".
It's like if someone offer you some caviar and you say "no thanks I'll have the burger".
It's a rejection of a value offer for a seemingly lower value offer (according to the offerer's value system).
That's for the social exchange part. Now let's talk about the:
Machiavellian mistake
The mistake comes in the fact that now they're less likely to invest in me. I'm now "another guy passing through". Even if I bring value with all the projects I bring to the pediatrics department. This value they would have not gotten otherwise as before they did not have such project.
So I could have stayed in the grey area, not refusing nor accepting:
Me: Thank you very much for considering me. Yes, it's something I considered and for now I feel like need more experience in another hospital or abroad. For instance, I'm planning to do...
It's true I considered it and it's true that I want to gain more experience elsewhere and/or abroad.
I could have kept it more in the air.
Now let's take both scenarios:
1. I tell them I'm not interested (what I did)
They know I'm a straight talker and I can still tell them at the end of the contract:
Me: "Let's stay in touch, for now I need more experience but I had a great time at your hospital and would not mind coming back".
These are all true statements. So I think I can still smoothen it at the end. However, in the mean time I'm still not perceived as someone worth "to be invested in". The mistake I'm talking about. However, I'm more involved and proactive than people who have been working there long term or are projecting themselves to work there long term. So it's still interesting for them to trust me with high impact project and to teach me what they know. Plus the more I know the better I do my job and the better their reputation.
Note: This hospital did not have such a good reputation in the past and we are all working to improve it.
2. I tell them I might be interested in the future
In this scenario I probably will capture more value from them as they will invest more in hope for future ROI. However if at the end of the contract I say:
Me: well we'll see.
They might feel cheated and maybe resentful. Like they've been played. So probably not as interested in me in the future now.
Final analysis
In the end I'm not sure it was such a mistake.
By saying I want to work as a teamleader in the field and that I want to improve my skills in another hospital/abroad, I think I framed myself as high-value. By being a straight-talker I think I framed myself as high-quality.
So not as bad as I thought when I started to write this post. Since I invest a lot in the hospital they probably will continue to invest back in me.
For this future spot I think it might not be such an opportunity now as they are now probably thinking about my power player colleague for these roles.
However, if I say "yes" I will stay in a regional hospital or in a private practice and I will not be able to improve my skills as much as if I gain experience elsewhere.

Hello TPM community,

I made a machiavellian mistake.

During my last performance review at the regional hospital I'm working in, I had a great evaluation. Staff physicians asked me if I was interested in becoming a staff physician in a regional hospital in the future. They also asked me if I was interested in having my own private practice (as an employee from the hospital). That was coming from 2 staff physicians who are going to leave soon the hospital. So it's for the future of the pediatrics department, not for their interest (high value high quality people).

Translation: "do you want to become part of the staff physician team in the future in this hospital? If yes we have a spot for you. If not you can have your own practice"

I thanked them and answered that I was more interested in being an attending physician, to do team-leading in the field. I also told them that I feel I need more experience in another hospital and/or abroad. Also I'm not interested in having my own practice as the work is not as interesting as the hospital (routine well-child visit checks, benign viral infections: lots of advice and reassurance not so much interesting diagnostics and treatment).

Indeed, staff physicians do more meetings, more paperwork and also have night shifts. They get a good salary though (250'000 euros gross a year). It's basically upper management work. So it's a great honour they did to me. Especially knowing how many critical and demeaning bosses I met before.

Until this point: fair enough. Honest straight talk from me.

However, it's still a rejection. I still bring value and all. However it could frame me as thinking "I'm too good for their offer".

It's like if someone offer you some caviar and you say "no thanks I'll have the burger".

It's a rejection of a value offer for a seemingly lower value offer (according to the offerer's value system).

That's for the social exchange part. Now let's talk about the:

Machiavellian mistake

The mistake comes in the fact that now they're less likely to invest in me. I'm now "another guy passing through". Even if I bring value with all the projects I bring to the pediatrics department. This value they would have not gotten otherwise as before they did not have such project.

So I could have stayed in the grey area, not refusing nor accepting:

Me: Thank you very much for considering me. Yes, it's something I considered and for now I feel like need more experience in another hospital or abroad. For instance, I'm planning to do...

It's true I considered it and it's true that I want to gain more experience elsewhere and/or abroad.

I could have kept it more in the air.

Now let's take both scenarios:

1. I tell them I'm not interested (what I did)

They know I'm a straight talker and I can still tell them at the end of the contract:

Me: "Let's stay in touch, for now I need more experience but I had a great time at your hospital and would not mind coming back".

These are all true statements. So I think I can still smoothen it at the end. However, in the mean time I'm still not perceived as someone worth "to be invested in". The mistake I'm talking about. However, I'm more involved and proactive than people who have been working there long term or are projecting themselves to work there long term. So it's still interesting for them to trust me with high impact project and to teach me what they know. Plus the more I know the better I do my job and the better their reputation.

Note: This hospital did not have such a good reputation in the past and we are all working to improve it.

2. I tell them I might be interested in the future

In this scenario I probably will capture more value from them as they will invest more in hope for future ROI. However if at the end of the contract I say:

Me: well we'll see.

They might feel cheated and maybe resentful. Like they've been played. So probably not as interested in me in the future now.

Final analysis

In the end I'm not sure it was such a mistake.

By saying I want to work as a teamleader in the field and that I want to improve my skills in another hospital/abroad, I think I framed myself as high-value. By being a straight-talker I think I framed myself as high-quality.

So not as bad as I thought when I started to write this post. Since I invest a lot in the hospital they probably will continue to invest back in me.

For this future spot I think it might not be such an opportunity now as they are now probably thinking about my power player colleague for these roles.

However, if I say "yes" I will stay in a regional hospital or in a private practice and I will not be able to improve my skills as much as if I gain experience elsewhere.

Lucio Buffalmano, Jack and Power Duck have reacted to this post.

#2 · August 24, 2023, 6:23 pm

Yeah, great self-analysis John.

I think a great frame to postpone that decision is also this (this may not all apply to you of course, just a template):

You: I'm really happy to hear you say that because I respect you guys and would certainly be happy to work together (<---- keep the door open)
As for timelines, look, I'm very driven, I seek personal growth and knowledge a lot, and I focus a lot on the added value I bring to the table. (<---- frame of "I focus on adding YOU the most value", WIIFT)
And for this type of character that I am, to bring the most value, I feel that I need to grow even more. (<---- frames your rejection as you wanting to add even more value. For them? Maybe... With this frame you could add huge value to anyone though, so they'll need to win you over)
(add more details on how you want to grow)
I know, it's a bit of a perfectionist thing in a way (<---- carefully crafted vulnerability), but I hope that at least the patients and the hospital would benefit from it (smiles)

BAM!

From what you said, this also sounds all true.

They already wanted you.

And with this frame focused on their own gain (they winning an exceptional doctor), you make them REALLY want you (even more).

Ali Scarlett and John Freeman have reacted to this post.

Community, new content and Confidence University now available here.

#3 · August 24, 2023, 7:33 pm

Mic drop.

Lucio Buffalmano has reacted to this post.

#4 · August 24, 2023, 8:19 pm

In all seriousness thank you very much!

I think that it was clear that I was expressing admiration. I think it’s a bomb.

Lucio Buffalmano has reacted to this post.