Quote from B on March 22, 2022, 6:42 pm

Update: after much thought, and two weeks with no contact, I decided to call him, and he answered.

I think I leaned in this direction, even though I initially expected him to call me, after reading Lucio's comments on Ali's thread today about the other party being the customer and thus expecting some service.

I congratulated him on his position, told him I appreciated him coming to me as Lucio suggested and that I accepted the rate he asked.

We agreed I will now send him my invoice and he will ensure it is paid.

Thank you again Lucio and John for your help on this as well.

Edit: We also chit-chatted for 5 minutes. During this chit-chat, he asked me if I still worked for the company he introduced me to years ago. I said yes, then I found myself changing the subject by entering into "ingratiation mode" for a while (I said something along the lines of "you were the one to make that company grow to what it is now"), and he seemed to appreciate it, and even downplayed on it.

I think he was, in a way, "reminding me" of him having made a favor to me. Don't know if it qualifies as social scalping, as I felt it was somewhat true, as that company remains an important customer.

Also wondering why I entered into ingratiation mode immediately after. Maybe it was a way for me to "repay him with words", because I unconsciously felt he was scalping a bit.

Quote from Lucio Buffalmano on March 22, 2022, 11:47 pm

Nice going Bel, way to turn a principle into a actual action, and into a win, I'm glad it went well.

Quote from B on May 27, 2022, 12:56 am

Updating this thread: two months have passed since I issued my proforma, and no payment has happened yet.

Which to me somewhat proves that this person was (and still is) disrespecting me.

And also that it is very difficult for me to get respect from the people who got to know me when I was submissive and unaware. So much that I think my decision to lose almost all of them basically was inevitable. They just seem unable to believe I will do what it takes to get respect now.

I recently decided to systematize my collections process, and thus have sent today a first solicitation of payment to this person, like this:

Hi …,

can you make it so that my invoice is settled? I reenclose it here.

I read in a book by Foonberg that a lawyer should send three communications to ask for payment, escalating a bit each time, because the escalation gives the impression that you are serious in not wanting to be disrespected.

Which is perfectly in line with the progressive escalation method I learned from Lucio.

Foonberg says that ideally the first contact should be a neutral note by a secretary but, since I don’t have one…

I think in any case it’s better to communicate I want to be paid rather than wait passively that (some) people remember to pay my work, even if that makes me lose some clients.

And I just cannot believe that in the past I basically waited months to ask for payment after seeing my invoices go unsettled. At the time I saw it as an oversight on the part of the client, now I see it as deliberate disrespect to my work.

Quote from Lucio Buffalmano on May 27, 2022, 7:49 am

Yeah, I agree it's best not to wait long: non-paying customers aren't even customers :).

And customers who require frequent solicitation are underpaying you because the collection time is unpaid work.

Quote from B on June 8, 2022, 10:50 am

I now identify another red flag here, which was the fact that this person addressed me by name via e-mail without "hi", "dear" or similar.

In a formal setting like work, this way of addressing someone is a way of asserting control on the recipient.

I have prepared a second push for payment, trying to put together several things I learned here.

Option 1:

Hi ...,

I did not receive an answer to my message of ..., here below.

I would like to be able to keep working with you for future cases, but I can't do it if my overriding concern is that my work is paid.

I appreciate clear communication here: if there is a need for more time for payment we can talk about it, but I must be informed to agree on a solution acceptable for both.

Unless I receive payment within the next [x] days or that we agree o a possible alternative solution, I shall have to terminate our professional relationship.

I prefer to be able to keep working with you, but I can't do any different.

Kind regards

* click blockquote to expand

Option 2:

Hi ...,

I did not receive an answer to my message of ..., here below.

I appreciate clear communication: if there is a need for more time for payment we can talk about it, but I must be informed to agree on a solution acceptable for both.

Please make it so that my invoice, here reenclosed, is settled within [x] days.

Kind regards

* click blockquote to expand

Quote from B on June 8, 2022, 12:06 pm

Here is the solution I'm settling on:

Hi ...,

I did not receive an answer to my message of ..., here below.

I would like to be able to keep working with you for future cases, but I can't do it if my overriding concern is that my work is paid.

Unless I receive payment within the next [x] days or we agree on a possible alternative solution, I shall have to terminate our professional relationship.

I prefer to keep being able to working with you, but I can't do any different.

Kind regards

*click on blockquote to expand

Reasoning is the following.

My mistake so far in these situations (which led to the demise of the relationship with the client) was treating these occurrences as deal breakers, and pushing for payment as if my overriding concern was getting payment before respect.

The above message, on the contrary, leverages the needs of the client as well as mine. It communicates that:

• I am on his side;
• but our work relationship is a two-way street, and must be dealt with by agreement rather than by power moves or disrespect;
• I understand this delay in payment may be just a one-time thing, and I don't take it personally;
• but it must be avoided in the future;
• I would prefer to keep being able to work with the client;
• but I am not working ever again with the client if this is not a two-way street;
• I can always escalate further in the future (by suing for payment).

Finally, in case the client rethinks his position, the message does not sour the relationship in any way (which would have been the case with the other, more assertive option) and enables me to continue working with him.

It is akin to Lucio's suggestion to address situations where the client raises his voice to "override" my professional solutions: the best communication being, in those cases, to clearly state I am on the same side of the client, but it must be a two-way respectful relationship.

It may make sense, in particular situations, to also try to call the client on the phone before sending the above, as this message seems more suited to a third final contact asking for payment rather than to a second.

Quote from John Freeman on June 8, 2022, 2:02 pm

Hello Bel,

to me it’s a bit aggressive and reactive. Once again I would stay diplomatic and factual.

Dear Sir, dear Madam,

it has come to my attention that the payment on DATE has still not been received.

For the delay, there is an additional administrative fee of $10.

In the case your payment has been made as the time of this message, consider this message void.

Regards,

Bel

This is how the Swiss communicate. You give them the benefit of the doubt + remind them + make them pay for being late.

this payment is usually 10-20 dollars and such message will be sent after 4 weeks. If after an additional 4 weeks the payment has not been made, then an additional 10-20 dollars is added. They send 3 reminders usually. The last one is a warning that if payment is not made in time a society specialized in debt recovery will be mandated (In CH that means you will have to pay a couple hundreds more to get off the “pursuit list”, a list held by the state that tells you are a bad payer: difficulty to get loans). If you don’t need pay the mandated society, then the state will send a repo man.

Each reminder and the original bill contains the due date (updated each time).

So I would just have a process for unpaid bill in the Swiss way: 2 reminders first, then escalation. I would keep it very impersonal and power-protecting. All you want is the money, not damaging the relationship.

So I would make a standard message for late payment as this will happen again. Different possibilities: People forget, are not able to pay a given month, make it a low priority payment or are just not organized enough to keep up with their bills.

Caveat: What most people don’t know in CH is that you don’t have to pay the additional fee by law. If people agree to pay it it’s because they don’t know the law. In CH you can bill anyone for anything. If they paid and there is no legal basis or no service rendered, it’s their own fault. Strange but that is the system here.

This is of course to adapt to your culture/system.

Quote from B on June 8, 2022, 2:23 pm

Thanks John. Can’t add late payment fees under the law here, and can’t use collection services. All I can do is push, escalate and then ultimately sue, and before that I am also compelled to stop assisting the client.

Your feeling that my text is a bit aggressive is helpful. I’ll think about it.

Quote from John Freeman on June 8, 2022, 2:47 pm

Alright, I was afraid that it might have been hurtful, I’m glad it’s not. I decided to be honest with you so I’m glad it was taken as meant :)

In the case of your given context, I would take the gist of the message you wrote and make it more impersonal and factual.

I would still frame this as a reminder and give the benefit of the doubt to the client.