Quote from Lucio Buffalmano on December 26, 2021, 5:43 pm

Great one John.

It's a form of covert power move, nice and supportive on the surface, but actually disempowering (especially if coming from same-level or lower-level folks as in the examples).

I like the answers you propose a lot.
The "very good" from the superior is especially shrewd. He re-empowers himself by ignoring the power mover and his words -a slight disempowering move on its own, but fair here- and by putting in the last words -sub-communication is: "I'm in control here, and I end this", very high-power-.

The one with the friend is also good.
"You're welcome" there would also work well if it's 1:1, but if it's a group then what you propose works better because "you're welcome" might feel like you're rubbing into people's faces that you're organizing for them (not good because only one person power moved, not the whole group).

Quote from John Freeman on December 26, 2021, 6:34 pm

Thanks for your answer Lucio.

It was in a WhatsApp group. So I think my proposition was just a little bit too much rubbing it in their face. An alternative (one-across), would have to use reciprocity to neutralize the power move:

Example 2B (Friends):

• Me (organising an event): "So I booked the event"
• Friend: "Perfect John ;)"
• Me: "Thanks to you for coming! ;)"

Notice that I tend to neutralise the wink with a wink of my own. Reciprocity is a great all-around tool because it puts us back on the same level. For instance you're providing valuable and useful info to a friend, he answers with a "wink" with a text. Communicating: "I don't need this". Then I would answer with a wink (inside the text) while allowing him to save face to communicate: "You and I know you need this, but let's not talk about it".

For instance, I send a text with info from an article on TPM to a friend struggling with emotional dependency and having a healthy mindset with relationships. He answers:

• Friend: "Relationship analysed enough. Full stop. Observation made ;-)" (I don't need this info anymore)
• John: "Cool! ;-)" (We both know you do but it's alright)

It allows him to save face while communicating I'm not fooled.

The next day, of course he proceeds to talk to me about his relationship.

Quote from Lucio Buffalmano on December 27, 2021, 4:35 am

Yep, agreed, in a group chat the "thanks to you for coming" would have been even better.

Still, your initial reply was solid, and especially if using the function "reply", since the frame there is "I'm replying to this specific text / person".

Quote from John Freeman on December 27, 2021, 12:53 pm

Quote from Lucio Buffalmano on December 27, 2021, 4:35 am

Yep, agreed, in a group chat the "thanks to you for coming" would have been even better.

Still, your initial reply was solid, and especially if using the function "reply", since the frame there is "I'm replying to this specific text / person".

I missed the opportunity to use the "reply" function. That is much smarter. I'll do it next time. That explains why a member of the Whatsapp group replied:

• Other friend: "Thanks John the NO": french expression, means: Nice Organizator. They are people who are basically happy excited but low status working in tourist holiday camps ("Nice" as in harmless, "Organizator" as in leader: a paradoxical concept), so it's a disempowering power move
• John: "Haha, I'm just another football enthusiast ;)": here I refuse his frame and frame myself as part of the group which neutralizes the one-up move from my previous message and takes away his attack. It's ok as I'm still organizing, so we're back to status quo.

Quote from Kavalier on December 27, 2021, 2:15 pm

I myself do this a lot with friends, superiors, subordinates - in fact, everyone. "Perfect", "very good", "great" etc. I understand now that when I'm doing this I'm putting myself in a judge position - though this is not what I want to do.

So if someone says "so I did this task" or "I'm going to do this task", how can I keep the conversation going/show my satisfaction/acknowledge the fact in a way that doesn't frame myself as superior?

Quote from Lucio Buffalmano on December 27, 2021, 2:45 pm

Quote from Kavalier on December 27, 2021, 2:15 pm

I myself do this a lot with friends, superiors, subordinates - in fact, everyone. "Perfect", "very good", "great" etc. I understand now that when I'm doing this I'm putting myself in a judge position - though this is not what I want to do.

So if someone says "so I did this task" or "I'm going to do this task", how can I keep the conversation going/show my satisfaction/acknowledge the fact in a way that doesn't frame myself as superior?

Consider:

It's not the worst thing you could do.

It also depends on context and, generally speaking, if you're above someone, it's all good -because you're supposed to judge and reward-.

But hey, everything adds up, so it's better to fix it.

To avoid disempowering them or framing them as "executing tasks for you", then a few edits will fix it:

Great, thank you for doing that man, looking forward to it (or add something friendly / how it's helpful)  

Or if they're doing something you and/or others benefit from:

Great, it's much appreciated!

That is also a generally good habit to fall into.

Such as, it's very eagle and leader-like to give people proper credit when they do something for you or for the group.

It's good for them, but also good for you, because it encourages them to do more for you.
And if you give back as well, that's win-win.

If it's a group, it also encourages others to give, because they realize that giving is common in the group, and that it's rewarded.
These are crucial elements for healthy and well-performing teams, so this is quite important for leadership.
And that, too, is also win-win.

Makes sense?

Quote from Matthew Whitewood on December 27, 2021, 3:09 pm

Kavelier: I myself do this a lot with friends, superiors, subordinates - in fact, everyone. "Perfect", "very good", "great" etc. I understand now that when I'm doing this I'm putting myself in a judge position - though this is not what I want to do.

Lucio: It's NOT the worst thing you could do.

Lucio advised me before that, as you (Kavelier) mentioned, some people unintentionally play covert power moves.
Thanks for bringing up this point again because it highlights that people can simply be unaware and not intend to one-up.
Although the one-up dynamics still apply even when unintentional.

Quote from Kavalier on December 27, 2021, 5:30 pm

That makes a lot of sense! Thank you very much, guys!

Quote from Ali Scarlett on December 27, 2021, 7:34 pm

Thanks for starting this thread, John, I had a situation that felt very similar recently.

I recently accepted a position helping my father as the managing director of his professional cleaning company. And, not too long ago, we closed on a partnership deal with a real estate company.

The owner of the real estate company is also the owner of the property that we have under our care. And, a few days ago, she hired a handyman to install a new door lock for her.

Unfortunately, she wasn't fully sure of how to use it.

So, since I was heading over there with my cleaning team to get a feel for the property anyway, I offered to record a video for her showing her how it's done.

My thoughts on the situation were that:

• I'd be giving her value: more than a simple explanation (or directing her to Google), she'd be getting a brief video look at how it's done.
• She'd value the cleaning company more: for going beyond the scope of our work by sharing value that her handyman is supposed to give.

It also felt like tasking, but in this case, I was tasking myself with giving her this value. So, it felt OK.

This is how it went:

The "that would be great" was a small, acceptable judge role, in my opinion. And, following up with the "thank you" made the judge role here even more acceptable because she's acknowledging the value that I'm offering her.

After I gave that value though, this was her response:

The notes on the side of the screenshot are my opinion and open to feedback, as well as my thoughts below.

When she gave a "like" in response to my text, it felt like she was giving positive judgment. And, when she said "that's great" instead of "thank you," it only made it feel even more like judge credit awarding.

After she tried to change the subject, it also felt as if she was ending the acknowledgment there — giving her positive judgment and then moving on.

Where I think I could improve:

• Seeking credit acknowledgment twice: could come across as social credit scalping (see "dealing with people who force you to say 'thank you' — aka: 'service-oriented' folks"). But, it's only social credit scalping if it's overdone. And, in this case, I think it was fair to do it once in the beginning to be sure that I wasn't wasting my time recording the video and then again to make sure that I increased the company's social capital with the client.

Here's how I responded:

In this case, the way I see the situation is:

• The client is on the same level as me, so she doesn't have the power to take a judge role over me: she can provide me with feedback on my work to make our working relationship more of a win-win. And, similarly, I can provide her with feedback to make sure that we get along. But, it feels unfair for her to judge and assess my work as if she's my boss. And, once again, it would also be unfair for me to judge and assess her work as if to tell her how to do her job.

So, I frame ignored her judge credit awarding and moved on.

It was a group chat, so when she tried to change the topic, I let another member of my team continue the conversation so my frame ignoring came across more smoothly (as opposed to hitting her with dead silence and then moving on myself).

Whether the "that's great" was her way of saying "that was a great video" or her way of saying "I understand now" is still a bit unclear to me. But, regardless of what she meant, it still felt like a covert power move and, therefore, I handled it like one.

What do you think of this exchange?

Is there anything you would have done differently? Do you think that I misread the situation?

Would be curious to read your thoughts.