Quote from John Freeman on July 31, 2023, 10:55 pm

Hello,

at work one of the cashier at the public cafeteria is a woman in her 50s with a piercing above the upper lip.

After I had a few interactions with her as she tried to one-up me I smelled a manipulator. That is she one-upped me for small things (bank card not going through, etc.).

I'm at the break outside smoking a cigarette and there she is alone. I cannot avoid her as she saw me so if I turn back it will look weird. I sit down next to her and as expected here it goes. I had my defenses up due to our previous interaction. That is I was expecting power moves. So it was easier that if I did not know here. It was a 5 min conversation. I only keep the power moves.

Her: so you're in pediatrics (she already knows)

Me: exactly

Her: pediatricians are badly paid

Me: I don't think so (dubious face)

Her: I heard they were having a low pay.

Me: it's not the best paid profession in the medical field but not the worst.

Her: not everyone can be a staff physician in radiology.

Me: well as you said there are not many positions for this kind of job.

Me: I'm actually happy with my salary.

Her: it's important to like one does (with a slightly condescending tone). Some people work in a factory all day.

Me: yeah. Even in medicine some people don't like their jobs.

Her: With all the studies and stuff?

Me: [explains that sometimes after the studies people realize they don't like it but have invested too much to change]

Her: and that makes bad doctors

Her: there are not many men in this profession.

Me: yeah it's true. NOW there are not many men in this profession.

Analysis

There were 3 negatives frames: pediatricians are poor, it's not a manly job, some doctors are bad (this one I heard it so many times: attacking authorities. People have the same attacks towards police and politicians. Very very common. Especially from low power or low status people).

Her: so you're in pediatrics (she already knows)

Me: exactly

Her: pediatricians are badly paid

This is a first one-up. Right on the attack. I was prepared as I was 99% sure she was a manipulator/taker.

Me: I don't think so (dubious face)

The fact is I know the exact statistics of doctor's pays in Switzerland in private sector. In public sector it's about the same for everyone. In private sector pediatricians are the ones who are 3rd to last in the pay grade. So in the lowest paid medical professions. However, here I decide not to tell her this information for the only reason that it's an attack. It's not about the content. So I answer regarding the attack not the content. She want to imply that I have low value. I defend against this sub-communication.

Her: I heard they were having a low pay.

Thread expands.

Me: it's not the best paid profession in the medical field but not the worst.

Philosopher's frame. True statement. Potentially closes the topic.

Her: not everyone can be a staff physician in radiology.

Tries to take a higher stance using a straw man: "these guys are better (paid) than you. And you are not at this level". Well neither is she. But this just show how distorted vision of themselves they have. She's in her 50s working at a modest job (I did many jobs like this, not hating on them) and she takes the judge role. Face palm.

Me: well as you said there are not many positions for this kind of job.

This is actually an olive branch. I'm going also for a philosopher's frame to say: it is what it is.

Me: I'm actually happy with my salary.

To close the topic: I don't have any insecurity here. Go look somewhere else.

Her: it's important to like one does (with a slightly condescending tone). Some people work in a factory all day.

Here it's a trap. That's why I highlighted the "condescending". It could mean: "that's great that you love what you do" whether in the interaction it felt like: "well you are not well paid at least you like your job". It's all in the tone. Then she tries to bait me to take the higher ground and look down on factory workers. I don't take the bait. So we can see that this person is all about who's up who's down. This one is up this person is down. That's how they think: who's dominating me? who can I dominate? Sad but true. Poor attempt at feeling good and raising ones's self-esteem.

Me: yeah. Even in medicine some people don't like their jobs.

Here it was a mistake. I tried to normalize and go for: "everybody's the same: worker factory and doctors". That would work with a normal person. With her it's feeding negative thread about doctors. She has to serve all day doctors and nurses so you can imagine how this person feels about them.

Her: With all the studies and stuff?

Me: [explains that sometimes after the studies people realize they don't like it but have invested too much to change]

Her: and that makes bad doctors

That was a mistake from me. I thread-expanded on the negative thread that some doctors don't like their jobs. So I served it on a platter to her the conclusion. She was so happy about her conclusions. You should have seen her smile. It's so sad but this is the kind of emotional/spiritual food these people nourish themselves with. In the petty games of judging people and making other people feel inferior (which I did not. I was detached emotionally and observant. But I could see how it could have affected me if not in this emotional stance).

Her: there are not many men in this profession.

I'm glad I watched "meet the parents" after having done the lesson in PU. It's like when you rehearse an exam and the exact question you prepared come up in the exam. Here it's an attack on my masculinity. The logic goes this way: if it's a woman's job (she says it I never heard that before) then it's not manly to do it. Therefore one must be effeminate or gay or worse pedophile. Anyway all negative to very negative things.

Me: yeah it's true. NOW there are not many men in this profession.

Agree and redirect. It's quite recent that it's a majority of women. Maybe since 10-20 years top. So it's a recent phenomenon. That means that it's neither a man's job nor a woman's job. It's a job. It's not like nurses which has always been a woman's job or road worker which has always been a man's job.

The conversation did not go in that exact order but these are the frames and the gist of it. The conversation ended with "and that makes bad doctors" she was all happy because she felt she won. As I said I observed it as she went away.

So I think I did good. I was prepared I did not let her sink her emotional hooks and actively fought negative frames. The thing I could have done better is to not thread-expand on any negative frame regarding my profession. To be clear, I'm all for self-criticizing. Every profession has their biases and mannerisms. The thing is that I'm actually finding more and more that it's not something to be talked about with outsiders.

It's like people have the right to criticize their own family but you cannot. But not everyone criticizes their own family with anyone. Only with close and trusted ones who will listen and troubleshoot.

Outsiders will just have a more negative image of the person confiding and one would lose status.

Or it has to be both ways: I say shit about my profession and you say shit about yours. But then it's lose-lose so it's a no-no.

Basically I think it's good to protect one profession's image just as one's image. We talked about it already. Not to over-protect it as in not being able to take any criticism. As "@transitioned said (I'm paraphrasing here): there are enough people that are going to kick you down. Don't volunteer to do it yourself." (PS: I miss you man I hope you're good.)