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Smart Alec tasking me with his job
Quote from Transitioned on January 25, 2022, 11:22 amHad this late meeting yesterday. Meeting was a bit of a mess structure wise too many parties and not obvious who should be leading. There's this young ambitious guy David who often oversteps. He s an experienced support tech who often runs with detailed tech tasks. He s been dealing with this and authored the doc. Host asked him if he could present the doc. He made some excuse about not being ready to present and then said Transitioned do you have it?
I just grunted no with a bored tone.
Now I m a project manager. I m not meant to be down in the detail unless it's critical detail on some big problem. And it was definitely him all over this task.
Was a bit stunned. New one on me.
If I said No David I think that's your area.
Then I m blaming and throwing a team member under the bus - not cool.
I remember in PU the smart Alec form of dominance where they drag you into detail and lord it over you with their knowledge.
And the suggested defence was to go higher level. So I could say No David a bit too in the weeds for me.
Problem is in the context of a meeting about the details, that sounds like I'm putting myself above the team.
So for what looks like a simple one I m not sure how to respond or where it is in terms of damage on our traffic light scale
Had this late meeting yesterday. Meeting was a bit of a mess structure wise too many parties and not obvious who should be leading. There's this young ambitious guy David who often oversteps. He s an experienced support tech who often runs with detailed tech tasks. He s been dealing with this and authored the doc. Host asked him if he could present the doc. He made some excuse about not being ready to present and then said Transitioned do you have it?
I just grunted no with a bored tone.
Now I m a project manager. I m not meant to be down in the detail unless it's critical detail on some big problem. And it was definitely him all over this task.
Was a bit stunned. New one on me.
If I said No David I think that's your area.
Then I m blaming and throwing a team member under the bus - not cool.
I remember in PU the smart Alec form of dominance where they drag you into detail and lord it over you with their knowledge.
And the suggested defence was to go higher level. So I could say No David a bit too in the weeds for me.
Problem is in the context of a meeting about the details, that sounds like I'm putting myself above the team.
So for what looks like a simple one I m not sure how to respond or where it is in terms of damage on our traffic light scale
Quote from Growfast on January 25, 2022, 11:58 amIf David works under you and the whole Document was supposed to be done by him then him asking "do you have it?" is definitely red.
More so than tasking he tried to shift and/or share blame of him not doing his work on you.
Some responses to him saying that would be.
David - do you have it?
You - Excuse me? Or What? (With a "What is this guy talking about" Face)
David - Says something
You - We have discussed and agreed that this was entirely to be done by you. It's best you prepare this document and send it to the team. The earlier the better.
You (addressing others) - Let's continue with other presentations. Is everyone cool with that?
This is how I would have handled the situations.
What do you think?
If David works under you and the whole Document was supposed to be done by him then him asking "do you have it?" is definitely red.
More so than tasking he tried to shift and/or share blame of him not doing his work on you.
Some responses to him saying that would be.
David - do you have it?
You - Excuse me? Or What? (With a "What is this guy talking about" Face)
David - Says something
You - We have discussed and agreed that this was entirely to be done by you. It's best you prepare this document and send it to the team. The earlier the better.
You (addressing others) - Let's continue with other presentations. Is everyone cool with that?
This is how I would have handled the situations.
What do you think?
Quote from Transitioned on January 25, 2022, 12:15 pmThanks for the ideas. It definitely smelt wrong to me. in a properly setup project that is exactly right. Unfortunately this is the usual messed up transversal matrix setup. He has a line manager and a side door to my boss. I m actually. voting with my feet going back to my previous company for a promotion and pay rise.
This looks like it could be a category of power move where a subordinate tries to bring you into the detail to make it seem as if you are on the same level.
Thanks for the ideas. It definitely smelt wrong to me. in a properly setup project that is exactly right. Unfortunately this is the usual messed up transversal matrix setup. He has a line manager and a side door to my boss. I m actually. voting with my feet going back to my previous company for a promotion and pay rise.
This looks like it could be a category of power move where a subordinate tries to bring you into the detail to make it seem as if you are on the same level.
Quote from Growfast on January 25, 2022, 5:54 pmIf it's the case of transversal matrix.
Then a possible response is this.
David - Do you have it?
You - As I remember this was to be done entirely by you? Who did you share this work with?
This will bring forth if anyone else was involved in the job and if not his game will be exposed that he is shifting blame.
If it's the case of transversal matrix.
Then a possible response is this.
David - Do you have it?
You - As I remember this was to be done entirely by you? Who did you share this work with?
This will bring forth if anyone else was involved in the job and if not his game will be exposed that he is shifting blame.
Quote from John Freeman on January 25, 2022, 9:29 pmHello Transitioned,
challenging situation as he's doing this in public. So you have to defend. Moreover as someone said, it's red in this case. Ignoring won't cut it here I think.
I think here are the steps I would recommend:
- Challenge the frame: the frame here is: "you are supposed to have the presentation boss" (and this is why I cannot present it now). So he basically scapegoated you.
- Reframe it in a favourable and collaborative way
Example:
David - Do you have it?
You - What do you mean? (rejecting the frame, being surprised as you should be, and surfacing)
David - the presentation
You - Based on our previous discussions, you were supposed to have it and present it (exposes that he knows he was supposed to have it and he fucked up). But it's all good (But you're magnanimous and forgive him, allowing him to save face). As others said (Uses the power of the group), you can do it another time (task him back, agreeing with the group and taking back the leadership).
You - talking about the presentation.... (change of topic, so he cannot expand on it, you keep the leadership and move on, the message is clear for everyone)
He surprised you. He made you doubt that you should have it. He used the doubt in your mind against you. There is no doubt. He fucked up, you did not. He used also the fact that you would not want to appear like a bad person in front of the group. You don't have to. Social finesse this SOB!
More power to you!
Hello Transitioned,
challenging situation as he's doing this in public. So you have to defend. Moreover as someone said, it's red in this case. Ignoring won't cut it here I think.
I think here are the steps I would recommend:
- Challenge the frame: the frame here is: "you are supposed to have the presentation boss" (and this is why I cannot present it now). So he basically scapegoated you.
- Reframe it in a favourable and collaborative way
Example:
David - Do you have it?
You - What do you mean? (rejecting the frame, being surprised as you should be, and surfacing)
David - the presentation
You - Based on our previous discussions, you were supposed to have it and present it (exposes that he knows he was supposed to have it and he fucked up). But it's all good (But you're magnanimous and forgive him, allowing him to save face). As others said (Uses the power of the group), you can do it another time (task him back, agreeing with the group and taking back the leadership).
You - talking about the presentation.... (change of topic, so he cannot expand on it, you keep the leadership and move on, the message is clear for everyone)
He surprised you. He made you doubt that you should have it. He used the doubt in your mind against you. There is no doubt. He fucked up, you did not. He used also the fact that you would not want to appear like a bad person in front of the group. You don't have to. Social finesse this SOB!
More power to you!
Quote from Transitioned on January 25, 2022, 10:13 pmThanks guys
GrowFast great point I could have used "you were working on it so who did you share it with ?" to highlight it was his job while moving on with the meeting. Thank you.
Thanks John
You re right he did surprise me with his audacity. Murky situation because my boss had setup the meeting and was there but he was sitting back and letting the main vendor drive it. It was also a difficult one for me to drive because I hadn't been involved that much. If you both think it's an obvious red it was. It was with several external vendors which was one of the reasons I was reluctant to slap down.
I like your sequence of tear down, excuse and move on.
Thanks guys
GrowFast great point I could have used "you were working on it so who did you share it with ?" to highlight it was his job while moving on with the meeting. Thank you.
Thanks John
You re right he did surprise me with his audacity. Murky situation because my boss had setup the meeting and was there but he was sitting back and letting the main vendor drive it. It was also a difficult one for me to drive because I hadn't been involved that much. If you both think it's an obvious red it was. It was with several external vendors which was one of the reasons I was reluctant to slap down.
I like your sequence of tear down, excuse and move on.
Quote from John Freeman on January 25, 2022, 10:20 pmI admit it's ballsy to pull out in front of a group. You can also go fo a variation of it. Whatever you can to avoid being scapegoated. Even a:
You: but you know it was up to you to do it (with a conscending tone as it was obvious).
And not defending! It would admit his frame and you would dig your own grave.
It can work better if in front of a whole group. It's important to move on after delivery though to prevent escalation and frame battle ("You're wrong I'm right" type of thing)
I admit it's ballsy to pull out in front of a group. You can also go fo a variation of it. Whatever you can to avoid being scapegoated. Even a:
You: but you know it was up to you to do it (with a conscending tone as it was obvious).
And not defending! It would admit his frame and you would dig your own grave.
It can work better if in front of a whole group. It's important to move on after delivery though to prevent escalation and frame battle ("You're wrong I'm right" type of thing)
Quote from Scarlett on January 26, 2022, 4:23 amOne option could be that you could throw the ball back to him while seeming collaborative
David: Do you have it?
Transitioned: If for whatever reason, you cannot manage to prepare a presentation in time, it would help to let us know in advance. (or direct to the host)
Or put the ball back to his court with his type of questions as well:
David: Do you have it?
Transitioned: You didn't prepare your presentation? (the surprise tone, not the accusatory tone)
One option could be that you could throw the ball back to him while seeming collaborative
David: Do you have it?
Transitioned: If for whatever reason, you cannot manage to prepare a presentation in time, it would help to let us know in advance. (or direct to the host)
Or put the ball back to his court with his type of questions as well:
David: Do you have it?
Transitioned: You didn't prepare your presentation? (the surprise tone, not the accusatory tone)
Quote from ZenDancer on January 26, 2022, 8:33 pmFor me, tonality is really key in a situation like that... personally, I wouldn't be overly explicit about overtly sending the message 'it's your job / fault / you screwed up, not me'... I think surprise at the question being asked can be effectively communicated with a pause and a calm smile - don't take too stunned or condescending a tone. So when he said 'Do you have it'.. I'd just look him square in the face, smile, pause and gently say 'No, I'm not across that'... if done with the right energy, I think it can communicate surprise and confidence to the room... just my two cents ;)
For me, tonality is really key in a situation like that... personally, I wouldn't be overly explicit about overtly sending the message 'it's your job / fault / you screwed up, not me'... I think surprise at the question being asked can be effectively communicated with a pause and a calm smile - don't take too stunned or condescending a tone. So when he said 'Do you have it'.. I'd just look him square in the face, smile, pause and gently say 'No, I'm not across that'... if done with the right energy, I think it can communicate surprise and confidence to the room... just my two cents ;)
Quote from Transitioned on January 26, 2022, 10:11 pmThanks guys all good ideas that I would use in different variations of this scenario. I llke @zendancer s minimalist approach too.
Still tricky because the meeting topic was detailed and important which I should be across to some extent. "Not across" might be risky
Sowhat do you all think of these two: "I think you're more across the detail David"
Show the hand might work. I"think as you were coordinatinge this everyone assumed you d be presenting. Do you remember who you sent it to last?"
Thanks guys all good ideas that I would use in different variations of this scenario. I llke @zendancer s minimalist approach too.
Still tricky because the meeting topic was detailed and important which I should be across to some extent. "Not across" might be risky
Sowhat do you all think of these two: "I think you're more across the detail David"
Show the hand might work. I"think as you were coordinatinge this everyone assumed you d be presenting. Do you remember who you sent it to last?"
