The "Feel" Questionning Process
Hello,
What would be the right order of questioning to best address the situation?
1/ Are they empowering me or disempowering me?
2/ Are they taking or giving value?
3/ Are they being friendly or rude?
4/
5/..
Welcome to the forum, Mathieu. First, we need more context; what is the situation?
In general, it all comes down to value - does something move towards or away from it? Doing that means knowing what you value. 1 and 3 come out from there.
There is so much content in PU. And I am having a hard time to use it and apply it to real life situation.
For instance, a frennemie reached out: "Hey, are you already bored back to France or are you ok?".
I don't know how to address this.
Another example: "Someone in a group of friends address me using 3rd person and say: "Oh he's unbearable haha"
Another example: During a discussion, someone has small laugh, mocking-type laugh, very judgmental in response to one of my statement.
See? How do I calibrate, and know what to do? I use an eagle frame? I use a self-defense frame? I attack the judge and the authority? I Ignore?
I want to respond properly, I would like to have a list of questions to narrow down the options.
Quote from Mathieu on November 26, 2021, 10:12 pmHello,
What would be the right order of questioning to best address the situation?
1/ Are they empowering me or disempowering me?
2/ Are they taking or giving value?
3/ Are they being friendly or rude?
4/
5/..
Hey Mathieu,
You might be missing the main picture here which is:
They're all the same.
It's just different levels of granularity.
- Value comes first: as Kellvo points out, this is the biggest category. Because one can be fake-friendly in your face, but spread rumors behind your back. And one might give you a feedback that you think was delivered in a rude manner, but he does it 1:1, so he doesn't ruin your reputation, and the feedback is invaluable. And then they're still adding value overall.
There is still obviously some major overlap among them all, since people who are rude are also being unfriendly and most of the time both are taking value.
But the first and main question you should ask is: are they adding value to me, my life, my goals, or are they taking value?
---
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Quote from Mathieu on November 26, 2021, 11:33 pmSee? How do I calibrate, and know what to do? I use an eagle frame? I use a self-defense frame? I attack the judge and the authority? I Ignore?
I want to respond properly, I would like to have a list of questions to narrow down the options.
You might be overly critical towards yourself, Mathieu.
The first, and probably most important first step, is to recognize that there is something wrong with those examples you share.
And there is something wrong.
You spotted it.
It's already a good place to be in.
You're not blind now, you see.
That's already a major conquest.
Now you're asking yourself to be able to deal with it in the most effective way possible.
You're asking for the most advanced stuff.
And the most advanced stuff almost always takes both some mental and real-life legwork.
Different mindset for you: stop seeking holy grails, embrace the work
Quote from Mathieu on November 26, 2021, 11:33 pmI would like to have a list of questions to narrow down the options.
I'm thinking about something like this as I type.
It would be a "holy grail" of effective socialization.
The equivalent of a shake that builds a lean or muscular physique without exercise.
Or a pill that makes you healthy while you can eat all the junk food you want.
But here's the point: these are holy grails for a reason. And the reason is that the many self-development's industry "holy grails" are actually pipe dreams.
You want a good body? You gotta move.
You want to stay healthy, you do gotta purge junk food and eat healthily.
You want to reach high levels of social effectiveness: you gotta live it, think it through, and test it out. And sometimes you'll lose and it will sting, but you'll learn from it and come out better.
PU helps you in all of those steps along the way, but maybe you're asking if you're expecting the simple solution.
So in the meanwhile that I think of something to further simplify and assess different scenarios, here's a different mindset for you:
Instead of looking for the immediate solution, embrace the learning phase.
Different mindset for me: stop denying holy grails, embrace the quest for holy grails
That being said:
While it's good for you not to seek holy grails but to focus on work, I should think of holy grails.
Because even if the holy grail might not exist, I might still be able to further simplify things for everyone.
So right now I"m thinking of how to make the process of spotting / diagnostics / analysis / solution more helpful and intuitive.
Diagnostic questions
The first draft of a set of questions:
- Can I catch the power move?: the most basic "feel" level. In your case, you're already in good part here (of course you can improve, but you were able to spot those power moves, so you already got a good chunk of the basics)
- Analysis 1: why / root causes: why did those power moves happen in the first place?
- Personality / behavior: am I actually "unbearable", unfriendly, too meek, or do I bore people for some reasons?
- Situation: Did I have it coming, did I do something socially wrong in that specific case?
- Power dynamics: are they afraid of my potential? Am I being too low-power and people think I'm an easy peg for their posturing and social climbing?
- Social skills: am I failing to develop solid win-win relationships? Can I do better to develop and maintain my relationships as value-adding win-wins?
- People: is it a people's issue? Are my friends behaving the same with everyone else? Are they value-takers to the core, that they can't even see the possibility of win-win?
- Analysis 2: what exactly happened
- What it meant to me when they did/say X
- Did I lose power / status?
- How it framed me, or our interactions?
- Analysis 3: deeper solutions
- Should I address deep-seated behavior in myself?
- Should I address mindsets and/or beliefs?
- Should I improve my skills to make better friends and develop better relationships?
- Are my friends a bunch of turkeys and maybe I should ignore them until I make better friends (possible, but don't jump to this conclusion)
- Analysis 4: immediate solutions (techniques): only after we've cleared the basics we get to the techniques level. This level is no less important than all the others, but it just happens to come after. And if you deal with the basics, you'll need the techniques a heck a lot less
- Come up with solutions to the specific examples
- Run those solutions in your head and see how they'd work
- Think what others might say or do and where you could go from there
- Share those solutions here for feedback
- Test them out in real life: the mindset is "something is always better than nothing. If I fail, I learn"
As I think about it, the top 4 are the most basic diagnositc questions that help you get to the bottom of the issues.
I think several guys who've gotten PU and/or come the forum but didn't make the most out of it -learned little or even got angry when they were asking for the simple solutions- didn't have an issue with "techniques".
They had an issue with why they were calling so many power moves on themselves.
Once you've cleared the basics, then you're good and can more effectively focus on techniques.
And to do that effectively, take every single one of those examples, seek to give yourself an answer, then propose it here for feedback.
---
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A great input, and the diagnostic questions really hit home. I've been so busy with getting life in command, mastering power moves and coming from a strong, grounded and dominant presence that I never thought to ask - 'am I drawing fire on myself?' I've definitely been told I come on too strong several times before. And ignored/didn't think of others' perspectives a lot. And been a bit excessive and aggressive in my response to others' power moves many times. I'm like a bulldozer relentlessly going forward towards his goals and I often forget the impact I have on others in the process. I often win over others with sheer energy, presence and sincerely engaging and caring about them, but at the same time I've definitely been an asshole too.
I'll chew on this today and learn my lessons.
We are in whatsapp group. A topic comes in. My friend starts telling his story about a cousin who experienced something. I go in parallel sharing different ideas about this same topic.
After a few messages, he goes:
“He is unbearable haha.”
And 2 posts later he goes another time:
“He is unbearable haha.”
1.Power move:
An insult. Covert with humor/laughter. So kind of a joke. A demeaning joke.
There is social climbing. He is diminishing me to gain more power, trying to increase his status.
It’s a one-up? Not sure cause I don’t feel like I lose control/autonomy.
But it’s value taking from my values that are: being straight/honest/respectful.
2.
Behavior/personality:
Am I unbearable sometimes?
Yes, I sometimes can overtalk about things. Maybe just to prove myself or because I am trying to assert dominance. Like talking, talking, talking...
Situation
Did I see this coming? Yes, I felt I was not listening him. He was trying to impose his thread. I was following mine.
Was it wrong? That was not an eagle move. There is no need to impose. But there can be 2 thread at the same time. It’s just richer. No need to demean the other guy. Unless there is some power games I guess.
Social skills
Am I failing to develop win-win? Probably I am failing to keep it light. And fun. Maybe taking things too personal. Too serious.
Power dynamic:
Is he afraid I take too much power? Or am I not showing enough power?
I think it could be both. Hard to say. He might resent that I ignore his words, and go in my own direction. Or he could just be having fun with me cause he knows I will know how to one-up back at him.
People:
He is a very dominant, status driven person. It’s all about this with him. So Yes, he does it with others.
- What exactly happened
1/ when he said that it meant to me is:
I am boring, I am socially awkward, and I’m weird. Like I don’t get the meaning of things. I am off-track. I miss the true meaning, and the point. I misinterpret the meaning and therefore I am stupid, laughable, less.
2/ I felt like I lost power (but what is it exactly, cause I didn’t feel a loss of control) and status, and value.
He is superior (get under my skin) and I’m inferior (feeling unworthiness).
3/ it framed me as the low-value, weird, socially unskilled guy (potential for ostracizing) and the interaction as he is the guy that leads and me as the guy that leads in a bad way and in the wrong direction.
4/ Deeper solutions
Behavior:
I should probably address the need to be dominant and the fear of being judged badly and being labelled awkward.
Mindset/beliefs: I don’t like to be dominated. To feel someone is trying to impose his frame. The mindset I guess should be: here is an opportunity to use PU content and win the dominance game.
Skills to be improved: the skills to address those things with calibrated response and maintain a good relationship.
Friends: I know he is a Turkey. He speaks like “You know who I am”, he is always pushing other’s status/achievements/actions down behind their back, he gives deameaning nicknames to others. But his status driven mindset to me is a source of learning. I learn to see things in a different way.
5.
Solutions:
Besides ignoring, it’s saying:
1/ Excuse me? This is the one I chose. And he never replied. He ignored it.
2/ Dude, if you’ve got something to say, a critic or something, say it straight, don’t hide behind “haha”.
3/ You’re right. I should have listened to and follow on your thread. I got a bit too excited. Well done.
4/ You call me unbearable?
5/ Dude, that’ rude of you. Why are you saying this?
6/ It’s not about being unbearable, it’s about everyone having a say in a conversation. Why do you think there something wrong with everyone’s sharing?
7/ I don’t know what lead you to say that but it’s very rude and I have no intention of dealing with that tone.