What do you think of MGTOW?
Hi Lucio, I love your blog man, I'm a big fan. I heard you talking about the red pill, and you say some stuff are good but overall you don't recommend it. I have never heard you speak of MGTOW (man going their own way) and I was curious about your opinion there. What do you think about MGTOW? Thanks
Hey man,
Just to be precise about the red pill: more than "not recommending", I warned readers here against a few issues in there.
When it comes to learning, there are too many generalizations to truly learn what's true and what works.
And when it comes to personal development, there is some obvious misogyny and bitterness, and I wouldn't want people that I care about to fall for either of those.
But if one can look at TRP without catching those contagious diseases, then it can even be an informative as well as an entertaining read.
Bad Reasons to Go MGTOW
I see a few different ways to enter MGTOW.
These are the ones I consider to be poor reasons:
- Guy is afraid of being ripped off by marriage (there are plenty of ways to mitigate that risk, from asset protection to pre-nups, to not marrying)
- Guy is afraid of being cheated by a woman
- Guy is afraid a woman "can't truly love him", so prefers not taking the risk
In short, almost any decision that is based on overblown fears can't be a good decision.
- Guy has not had success with women, and throws in the towel too early
Out of 6 billion people, there must be someone for anyone.
More often it's more about looking harder and getting over the ego-protection mechanisms.
- Guy dislikes women / misogyny
This is the biggest danger of spending time in that community.
A natural group self-preservation mechanism is to remind the members that they have done the right choice. And what's one way to do that? Reminding each other how bad women are.
This is the main reason why even if you want to go MGTOW, I would still recommend you not to spend too much time on those boards.
Going MGTOW can be a good and healthy choice, but harping on about it and complaining about women is not.
Acceptable Reasons to Go MGTOW
And these are reasons where going MGTOW is a fair choice:
- Guy is not particularly attracted to women, so decides to not pursue them and live without an intimate relationship (nothing to be ashamed about, around 1% of the population is asexual)
- Guy chooses to prioritize other life missions and aspects
- Guy temporarily stops pursuing women to prioritize other projects
In a way, going monk-mode is a bit like a mild, temporarily-limited "MGTOW", no?
And that's how I built most of this website.
Then there are other reasons which I can't understand but which can't be criticized on a rational basis.
For example, guys who simply don't care enough to be bothered to put in the work. Or guys who prefer to pay and get the sex without the hustle. That's the opposite of who I am, but... If that's what one prefers, who am I to criticize?
Overall: OK Only If You Got a Good Choice
Overall, I wouldn't encourage readers here to go MGTOW.
But if one has chosen it for the right reason, not based on fears or on falsehoods, then, all the best to him.
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I wanted to say Lucio, that your post on the dangers of the Red Pill really struck a chord in me. And for someone both heartbroken because he didn't know how to play the game and someone with a natural sense of pride and independence, MGTOW readily appealed to me. And there is good there - it teaches those who come to love themselves, to be strong and independent, and to seek a larger purpose in life.
But although they proclaim to be healers and seek acceptance, many do just the opposite of that. They figuratively tear open their wounds again and again; they remain in a state of bitterly rejecting reality instead of adapting to it. I left precisely of that, the complaining, the misogyny that was perpetuated over and over again. I love myself too much to poison my life with hatred.
I still flirt with MGTOW material; it reminds me to stay steadfast on my purpose, to love myself, and to recognize the very real dangers out there. But I don't stay too long. I have a life to live.
Thank you for sharing your first-hand experience, Kellvo!
You make great points on both the good side, and the dangers. If one can approach it with that level of awareness, then he can get all the upsides, without the downsides.
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On the red pill.
I'm pretty sure a large chunk of The Power Moves audience will dislike this.
But I just had to make a video on the red pill, the toxicity in it, and the poor, biased "analyses" its thought leaders share as truth (and some buy into):
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I confess I was a member of one of the mildly redpill sites. I think it's a continuum. We talked about a lot of the topics we discuss here but the discussion was unguided and much lower quality. Lucio does a magnificent job here as el patron. The senior posters all either had harems or LTRs so it seemed we were doing some good.
Took 6 months off dating once just to prove to myself I could do it. Been in LTRs or STRs most of my adult life.
It did allow a bit of healing and processing time. There is a fair bit of research saying single men don't look after their health well. So if u do opt mgtow I d say make health #1