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PD mating season(Journal dating)
BOOM, PD, you got some gold here from Bel and Kavalier.
Agree that the general direction is fantastic: doing things, and learning by doing and reflecting.
And this advice that you got here can take literally 10x and make you go 10x times faster.
So my message here is only to say "great work" and "reflect and make the most of the advice you got because it's top-notch".
Deep thanks Bel.
To be honest I'm still a bit confused about chasing&leading to set dates while not chasing much. I guess it's something one feels just like being dominant, receiving power moves, etc, it comes with practice and knowledge. Still it's something good to know.
To sum it up the way I proposed her to meet was asking for a day in which she was free and then:
PD: cheesecake on Monday then
Not making a big deal out of it.
Her: to celebrate that I'm going to fail the test?
PD: to celebrate you aren't going to drop out of math.
Her: hahhahaha
Her quoting my last message: let's suppose it's true (a math joke)
More small talk and bantering but doesn't agree to meet.
Her: wait I'll answer you now (3 hours later I tell her that it's been 3 hours)
Again deep thanks for the response. It's really helpful to understand dating dynamics, and other things I need to improve.
Again, deep thanks Bel.
Deep thanks Kavalier.
Your response made me realize something: I spend lots of time in lower levels of consciousness, when I'm facing a problem I usually think if what I did is correct/how can I fix it/related to me, but I barely think: how did that affect said individual, how would he/she feel?/ How would I feel if I were them? Needless to say that to be a high quality person, empathy, specially in close relationships, is a must. So, thanks for that.
About the voices, funny enough, some of them were wrong. I answered back when she told me the reasons for her not being able to meet, basically:
PD quoting her power move: hahahaha, seems like a WA misunderstanding. That's why I prefer calling.
PD: for sure we can meet when we both have time blablabla.
To my surprise she responded by telling me that:
- She wasn't lying when saying she couldn't meet, but she's overwhelmed right now because she just got to college and has lots of things to do.
- She wants to get to know me more, and finds me really interesting.
- We can talk in college and on the way to the bus.
- Thanked me for helping her.
- Complimented me a bit more.
- Wanted to meet me and didn't want the date to be canceled because of a misunderstanding.
Basically pointed out the elephant in the room, took the leadership and risked getting rejection. Lol.
Of course after that I qualified her and took the leadership again.
Quite a strange girl, but in a good way.
Leaving all that aside, I still have to reflect on all the things I could've done differently, will write my reflections here.
Again, deep thanks Kav.
Quote from Power Duck on October 29, 2023, 9:19 amDeep thanks Bel.
Thank you for the thank you, Power Duck.
To be honest I'm still a bit confused about chasing&leading to set dates while not chasing much. I guess it's something one feels just like being dominant, receiving power moves, etc, it comes with practice and knowledge. Still it's something good to know.
Like everything else in life, it's a calibration that only comes with experience.
It's impossible to convey all the possible nuances of how to best act in various situations beforehand, but with practice one improves to the point where one can handle basically almost everything.
Also consider: when starting out, resolving inner insecurities has the priority over "acting". Because inner insecurities lead to unconscious compensatory behaviors that turn off women.
To sum it up the way I proposed her to meet was asking for a day in which she was free and then:
PD: cheesecake on Monday then
Not making a big deal out of it.
Her: to celebrate that I'm going to fail the test?
PD: to celebrate you aren't going to drop out of math.
Her: hahhahaha
Her quoting my last message: let's suppose it's true (a math joke)
More small talk and bantering but doesn't agree to meet.
Her: wait I'll answer you now (3 hours later I tell her that it's been 3 hours)
While your proposal feels a bit too "imposing", I think she took it well.
There's a possibility that she would have answered you positively if you had waited.
Consider this: many women had the experience of guys blowing up their phones.
Some even consciously test men by deliberately making them wait and seeing how they behave, looking to see if the man has the patience to not do anything and wait.
Again deep thanks for the response. It's really helpful to understand dating dynamics, and other things I need to improve.
Again, deep thanks Bel.
Repeating this twice in the end was unintentional, didn't saw it while editing. I clarify it so there's no possibility for misunderstandings.
Cancelling on last moment:
Since this girl told me that she would like to meet and keep talking with me in college and in the bus, and since we both have an habit to arrive late at the bus stop: yesterday night I proposed to meet at the bus stop today, she agreed.
Today around 10 min before the agreed hour, she told me that her mother's car was free and that she would go to college in said car to practice, also apologized for telling me at last moment.
Let's say I didn't take it very..... nicely. However I calmed myself and tried to put myself in her shoes (without completely discarding other more malicious intentions from her part). Here's what I answered an hour later:
Her: PD good moorning!
Her: one thing, my mother just told me that she doesnt work today and I'm going in car to practice.
Her: sorry for telling you at the last moment.
PD: I suppose (in Spanish this sounds like: I'm going to suppose, but not as direct&value taking) that the car isn't usually free.
PD: in that case don't worry, it's important that you practice.
With this I take the judge position while not making a big deal out of it. Im going to suppose that this isn't a shit test, I'm realizing that I don't like women who play games to "test" me, but if this "I can't meet" keeps going I may stop the process of attracting her and focus on other girls from my degree.
Anyways putting myself in her shoes helps to view things in a different way, thanks for that Kav, simple yet brilliant advice.
P.S:
I recall reading in the book John recommended me that men with anxious attachment styles can get angry when faced with rejection. That could explain some things, the thing that creates the anger could be the thought/belief of having been lied/used.
Hi Power Duck.
my perspective on the facts you mention in your last post:
Quote from Power Duck on October 30, 2023, 10:09 amCancelling on last moment:
Since this girl told me that she would like to meet and keep talking with me in college and in the bus, and since we both have an habit to arrive late at the bus stop: yesterday night I proposed to meet at the bus stop today, she agreed.
My take on this situation:
When you propose a meet-up that doesn't push the interaction forward, women usually take it as an indication of disinterest from a "romantic" point of view, and as an indication that you like them as a friend and/or might be unsure.
Since you had already talked with her on the bus, I assume multiple times, you could have exchanged contacts and/or proposed a coffee or smoothie after college.
Saying "Let's meet tomorrow as well at the bus stop" IMO comes across as a bit fearful, as if you said "I need to feel more at ease with you before asking you out". It's what a woman would have proposed to a man to get him to realize he had to ask her out.
Today around 10 min before the agreed hour, she told me that her mother's car was free and that she would go to college in said car to practice, also apologized for telling me at last moment.
Now this doesn't totally count as a flake, since your proposal has more the vibe of a "friends meet-up" than a "date".
But still, the higher-level concept IMO is: when a woman flakes on you at the last minute, giving any response is usually a no-no.
In most cases, a woman who flakes on you at the last moment is basically indicating that she doesn't want to pursue a romantic relationship.
But there's a certain percentage of cases where women are unsure and on the fence, and unconsciously flake to see what the man will do.
The moment you communicate to her, in any way, that you are "ok" with this kind of flaky behavior, even by calling her out on it playfully, women instantly lose attraction.
If instead you go silent, and don't respond at all, there's a possibility she may call you back in the future and apologize, and ask you out.
So, if a woman flakes at the last minute, the general rule is: don't respond, don't call her again, don't ask her out again, do nothing.
In this case a woman may or may not come back.
But if the man pursues her again before that moment, he's usually significantly lowering attraction.
It may be possible sometimes to recover an interaction even after this kind of situation if you see her in person by chance, and the interaction restarts again from scratch. But it's very difficult.
Another golden post for you PD by Bel.
Of course you're learning, so all good and do all the mistakes possible (as long as you take note for future improvement).
It's an eary rule of thumb:
generally speaking, effective seduction adds no extra step.
So the question you always gotta ask yourself is:
How it this step going to move us forward?
If it doesn't, you don't take it.
Exceptions later on apply and once you know the rules great seductions are the opposite: they can purposefully become more wasteful, spend more time, etc.
But that's for later, and it's not even needed.
OFF-TOPIC
Would you be OK to move this journal in the dating section?
I think it's best for the forum and for you as well since there's more activity in the journal section so we can keep it separated by topic, and also avoid cannibalizing different journal updates.
Let me know if you're cool with that.
OFF-TOPIC
Sure, I think it would be better to move it to the dating section too
Hello guys
Thank you for your kind words, Lucio, Power Duck, Bel!
PD, just to add another idea to Lucio's and Bel's golden advices:
If you propose to meet women in ordinary situations like these, they may rationalize thay you expect to be with them all the time. In the not so bad scenario, I agree with Bel, they may take this an indication that you are qualifying for friendship. It also "cheapens" your presence (everything that becomes too regular, too abundant, too easily attainable, loses value. At least this is what economists say). So besides wasting time/effort when you add extra steps, as Lucio says, you also take a penalty in value.
In the worst case scenario... some might interpret this as you threading into stalker territory. While this is not what is trully happening here, we can't control what others will think, so we have to be careful.
My take here would be:
- Keep your presence to a minimum
- Keep your presence special (let her associate you not with mundane encounters, but with special occasions).
- Think your meeting invitations are limited. Transitioned here in the forum once talked about the "one chance per girl per lifetime" rule of the universe, wich I thought was gold. (As Lucio says, it can be flexibilized over time)
- Avoid putting her in situations where she has to make excuses for not doing things she usually does just not to meet you (this doesn't seem to have happened here, she still seems to be receptive to you. But it can happen, so it's better to keep that in mind. Some women change their daily routines and even telephone numbers because of guys that are too pushy)
- As Lucio and Bel said before, this is the time to make mistakes. So, above all, don't be afraid to fuck up :D
