Forum breadcrumbs - You are here:ForumPublic Forum: DatingSexual dynamics in songs
Please or Register to create posts and topics.

Sexual dynamics in songs

12

Sometimes I listen to some songs I love.

And then I start paying deeper attention to the lyrics.

And I realize that they are not just artistic expressions, but also a special conduit to understanding sexual dynamics.
Songs can be the sweetest way to learn sexual strategies and improve our mating intelligence.

This thread analyzes songs and lyrics and what do they say about sexual dynamics.

sensual singer jennifer connelly


WHO SINGS IT?

The first thing one should take note of is who sings it.

Is it a man, or a woman? That's the most important thing.
Then, look at the singer.

Rocker type, romantic guy, "lover" type, chubbier woman, sexy woman, repressed woman... Both the physiology as well as the lifestyle tell you a lot on how to interpret the lyrics.


MARKETING VS REAL EXPERIENCES

Of course, some songs are planned to be appealing.

But some singers write based on their life experiences, including their deepest loves and most painful heartbreaks.

Both can add value, actually.

Men singing about "the one", even if pre-planned, tell you what's appealing to the masses of (average?) men dreaming about "the one".
Same goes for songs about the "impossible man just behind her reach" (can you catch the quote? :), appealing to many women's fantasies.

But it's best to differentiate between a marketing-led song, and an honest expression of a singer's heart and feelings.


So let's start 🙂

Have you read the forum guidelines for effective communication already?

Catchy rhythm, fun as well as deep lyrics, empowered woman... What's not to like about Allen's "It's So Unfair":

Lilly Allen - It's So Unfair

Key takeaways:

  • Sexual chemistry matters, especially if you're dealing with an orgasmic and experience woman (doesn't matter much with women who're out of touch with their sexuality, never orgasmed in their life, or cannot orgasm, and it matters less with less experienced women)
  • Sexual effectiveness is a window into physical capabilities: it's a good thing for men to be able to outlast their women and tire them more than he gets tired (tip: make them do their part!). Staying in shape is never a bad idea :).
  • Men should leave her some space and not chase too hard: chasing too hard leaves no space for the woman to invest. And the best romances include mutual escalation of investment.
    "Calling 15 times a day" robs her of a chance of investing, making her like him less (exceptions apply, like in whirlwind romance, but for whirlwind romance to work, she must like him a lot)

LYRICS:

Oh, he treats me with respect
He says he loves me all the time
He calls me fifteen times a day
He likes to make sure that I'm fine
You know I've never met a man
Who's made me feel quite so secure
He's not like all them other boys
They're all so dumb and immature

[Pre-Chorus]
There's just one thing
That's getting in the way
When we go up to bed
You're just no good, it's such a shame
I look into your eyes
I want to get to know ya
And then you make this noise
And it's apparent it's all over

[Chorus]
It's not fair
And I think you're really mean
I think you're really mean
I think you're really mean
Oh, you're supposed to care
But you never make me scream
You never make me scream
Oh, it's not fair
And it's really not okay
It's really not okay
It's really not okay
Oh, you're supposed to care
But all you do is take
Yeah, all you do is take

[Verse 2]
Oh, I lie here in the wet patch
In the middle of the bed
I'm feeling pretty damn hard done by
I spent ages giving head
Then I remember all the nice things
That you ever said to me
Maybe I'm just overreacting
Maybe you're the one for me

[Pre-Chorus]
There's just one thing
That's getting in the way
When we go up to bed
You're just no good, it's such a shame
I look into your eyes
I want to get to know ya
And then you make this noise
And it's apparent it's all over

[Chorus]
It's not fair
And I think you're really mean
I think you're really mean
I think you're really mean
Oh, you're supposed to care
But you never make me scream
You never make me scream
Oh, it's not fair
And it's really not okay
It's really not okay
It's really not okay
Oh, you're supposed to care
But all you do is take
Yeah, all you do is take

[Pre-Chorus]
There's just one thing
That's getting in the way
When we go up to bed
You're just no good, it's such a shame
I look into your eyes
I want to get to know ya
And then you make this noise
And it's apparent it's all over

[Chorus]
It's not fair
And I think you're really mean
I think you're really mean
I think you're really mean
Oh, you're supposed to care
But you never make me scream
You never make me scream
Oh, it's not fair
And it's really not okay
It's really not okay
It's really not okay
Oh, you're supposed to care
But all you do is take
Yeah, all you do is take


KEY PASSAGES:

You never make me scream

An obvious reference to him not providing the type of sexual experience she likes / enjoy

All you do is take

Wow, this is the most powerful line for me.

Great relationships are a give and take, and this guy is only taking.

Calling 15 times a day means shit if at the end of the one is a taker.

Oh, he treats me with respect
He says he loves me all the time
He calls me fifteen times a day

Obvious reference to "Mr. too nice guy".

It's easy to misunderstand these lines though.
Treating with respect does not take any point away, and neither does giving. As a matter of fact, they add value... As long as it comes from a high-power position.

This guy comes from a low power position, so everything he does, it looks like he's desperately trying to make up for a value imbalance.


 

He's not like all them other boys
They're all so dumb and immature

Being mature is a great bonus point for women, including many younger ones.

But, again, there are caveats.
Mature is not synonymous of "boring" or, of course, "asexual".


 

When we go up to bed
You're just no good, it's such a shame
I look into your eyes
I want to get to know ya
And then you make this noise
And it's apparent it's all over

While upon first hearing this song I this song was singing about a type of woman who's "high sex drive / lower emotional bonding".

But these lyrics say the opposite.

She's probably high in both.
She's well in touch with her sexuality, she's orgasmic, but also wants to connect -"look in your eyes / I want to get to know you" (women who are only high in sexuality and zero in bonding/connection are very rare anyway).

But "it's apparent it's all over" too quickly for that.

One night stands are less about intimacy and bonding.

But in relationships, sex is also bonding and intimacy, of course.
These lyrics of her wanting to look into his eyes reminded me of an ex-girlfriend of mine who complained I wanted to finish off from behind.
It was over not long after that.

Many times I purposefully avoided looking women for too long into their eyes while missionary, and especially not when finishing off.


Maybe I'm just overreacting
Maybe you're the one for me

This is common for women who are already in a relationship -and for many men as well-.

Instead of assessing things for what they are, they try to dupe themselves into thinking that things are actually good.

The worst kind of self-manipulation happens in abusive relationships, where women hope (against hope) that things will soon change.
The good times between episodes of abuse serve to feed and reinforce that (often false) belief.


Oh, I lie here in the wet patch
In the middle of the bed
I'm feeling pretty damn hard done by
I spent ages giving head

LOL, this is just funny, you'd think she was talking about lying in bed during a good fucking session, and instead she was doing all the work and "spending ages giving head" :).


Calling 15 times a day

Actually, this is also easy to misunderstand.

In the beginning of a relationship some women can take that as a sign of caring.

But excessive tab-keeping like this one is a huge red flag.
This is controlling behavior, and likely the sign of a jealous-paranoid, as well of a potentially abusive man.


OVERALL

Overall, she sings the song of a rather low-quality man.

The reason why she kept hanging in there was that he was so giving, which mislead her into believing he might have made for a long term-provider.

In truth, judging by these lyrics, he was probably also a jealous-paranoid man, and potentially abusive down the road.

Have you read the forum guidelines for effective communication already?

The reason why he kept hanging in there was that he was so giving, which mislead her into believing he might have made for a long term-provider.

SHE

Nice new Thread Lucio!

Thank you, Stef!

Have you read the forum guidelines for effective communication already?

"I Will Survive" - Glorya Gaynore

I love this song.
It's so "The Power Moves", that I wish I had put it first.

Key Power Dynamics Takeaways

  • She was stuck in an abusive relationship: probably not physically abusive, or she wouldn't have felt safe not changing the lock
  • She was emotionally addicted
  • The relationship seemed to be a codependent one: also see "codependent no more"
  • It seemed to be a toxic dance of "savior & sinner": such as, one partner always in trouble, the other always rescuing them. There's an overlap with parent/kid, him the deadbeat in the position of the kid, she's the responsible woman in the position of the mother
  • He was a leecher/taker

And pushing our little guessing-game envelop now:

  • It's possible he was attractive in some ways: some forms of personal attractiveness might have helped to hang in there despite his value-sucking ways. Some initial value often helps set up toxic relationships in which people wonder "what the fuck is he/she doing still there?"
  • It's possible there was an initial value imbalance: this is the politically-incorrect truth of some abusive relationship. One party gets addicted more easily because he/she feels that "the other one is higher value, so I must stay or I won't find someone else like him/her". Of course, even if that's true (and it's not always true), staying isn't worth the price of abuse. But people's addicted minds don't think very clearly.
  • It's possible the relationship was also sexually addictive: emotional up and down often (but not always) go hand-in-hand with sexual addiction as well. The makeup sex combines:
    • Sex itself tends to be higher charged when mixe with other emotions (including anger)
    • Positive reward: emotional component of regaining the emotional bond
    • Negative reinforcement (AKA "averse conditioning"): the addictive component of stopping the pain. Sex stops the pain of emotional disconnection. And this is how physically "normal" sex becomes addictive sex.

But we can't say these last 3 for sure.

Lyrics

At first I was afraid, I was petrified
Kept thinking I could never live without you by my side
But then I spent so many nights thinking how you did me wrong
And I grew strong, and I learned how to get along

And so you're back from outer space
I just walked in to find you here with that sad look upon your face
I should have changed that stupid lock
I should have made you leave your key
If I'd have known for just one second you'd be back to bother me

Go on now, go. Walk out the door
Just turn around now 'cause you're not welcome anymore
Weren't you the one who tried to hurt me with goodbye?
Did you think I'd crumble?
Did you think I'd lay down and die?

Oh, no, not I
I will survive
Oh, as long as I know how to love I know I'll stay alive
I've got all my life to live
I've got all my love to give
And I'll survive
I will survive, hey, hey

It took all the strength I had not to fall apart
Kept trying hard to mend the pieces of my broken heart
And I spent, oh, so many nights just feeling sorry for myself
I used to cry but now I hold my head up high

And you see me somebody new
I'm not that chained-up little person still in love with you
And so you felt like dropping in
And just expect me to be free
And now I'm saving all my loving for someone who's loving me

Go on now, go. Walk out the door
Just turn around now 'cause you're not welcome anymore
Weren't you the one who tried to break me with goodbye?
Did you think I'd crumble?
Did you think I'd lay down and die?
Oh, no, not I
I will survive
Oh, as long as I know how to love I know I'll stay alive
I've got all my life to live
I've got all my love to give
And I'll survive
I will survive

Go on now, go. Walk out the door
Just turn around now 'cause you're not welcome anymore
Weren't you the one who tried to break me with goodbye?
Did you think I'd crumble?
Did you think I'd lay down and die?
Oh, no, not I
I will survive
Oh, as long as I know how to love I know I'll stay alive
I've got all my life to live
I've got all my love to give
And I'll survive
I will survive
I will survive

KEY PASSAGES:

But then I spent so many nights thinking how you did me wrong
And I grew strong, and I learned how to get along

Focusing on the wrongdoings is a great technique to provide the determination to get started, or with the strength to "stay gone".
Smart woman.

And so you're back from outer space

Typical of some abusive types: they come and go.

It makes me think he might have been on the sociopathic end of the spectrum, since they tend to be more unstable, without their own place, and jobless.

The time they're away often only reinforces the attachment.
If they stayed gone, the woman would eventually heal.
But with the away-back-away-back, the effect is the addictive emotional up and down of "I feel bad when you're gone / I  feel better when you're here (please don't go anymore".
That weakens her position by reinforcing the feeling & belief she needs him to be happy (and to avoid pain).

I just walked in to find you here with that sad look upon your face

A single line, but that tells us SO much about this toxic relationship.

This is the line that suggested me that she was the savior, and him the troubled man/kid.

"Sad look upon your face" communicates he was putting up his little play of being in trouble, emotionally wounded, and needing her help.

He was no top/alpha man in the usual sense of the word but, contrary to what many think, some abusers are the complete opposite of what one would expect a strong man to be.
Sometimes they're artists, or at least position themselves as artistic souls in need of a woman to "center" them.

When they go into their little "poor me shows", to the outside, they are pathetic.
But the woman entangled, once she's already emotionally engaged, sees some sparklers of genius that "needs her touch to stay sane", which also plays/preys on her mothering instincts.

Go on now, go. Walk out the door
Just turn around now 'cause you're not welcome anymore

One of the best, most powerful lines in the song.

The tune has finally changed.

Sometimes in abusive relationships, something snaps inside the victim.
It can be a particularly strong instance of abuse, or the cumulative weight of all the smaller instances of abuse that finally snowballs into the avalanche of change.

It might be she becomes so disgusted with herself, that it gives her the power to bite the bullet, take the pain, and move on to salvage what's left of her self-respect. If there are kids around, his abusive behavior towards children strongly helps in that direction.

Or it can be she becomes disgusted by the abuser, which kills the love, decreases the addiction, and makes it easier for her to move.

Or, of course, it can also be the power of her resolve that finally tips the scale.

It took all the strength I had not to fall apart
Kept trying hard to mend the pieces of my broken heart

This is the good type of vulnerability.

She doesn't hide behind a fake shield of power negating her struggle.
But contrary to the bad type of vulnerability, she also takes action.

And I spent, oh, so many nights just feeling sorry for myself
I used to cry but now I hold my head up high

Another super-power line, contrasting her abused past, to her present empowerment.

And you see me somebody new
I'm not that chained-up little person still in love with you

There is some sweet taste of revenge here.

"Now you see me, somebody new... Ain't the one you knew before and you could control... MF. And I'm glad you get to see that".

There is some power and beauty in valid revenge, and the will to revenge is not always bad feelings to be stuffed inside.

  • Girl, or person?

Interestingly, in the song it sounds like she says "I'm not that little girl still in love with you", or at least that's how I always heard it.
It would be far more powerful if she said "little girl", as it would evoke an even stronger image of her being powerless and dependent.

This is what stumps some guys who seek power through abuse: the abused woman who can't get away is a little dependent girl.
And that makes them feel powerful.
On top of the obvious lowness of abuse, what they don't see is that one, that's lower overall power, since a stronger partner empowers you. And two, it's like pushing down a loaded spring, which can break free at any time.

This is also a line that applies beyond abusive relationships, and something I've sometimes thought about in my life.
When a girl is in love, and especially if she thinks highly of him, his power and influence are boundless. But if/when that loves dissipates (or disappears), then his power can also decrease... Unless he does have indeed strong qualities and it wasn't just infatuation/seduction.

This why I say on this website that if a man cares to remain the man-beacon of the relationship/family, being a high-quality man is the only true long-term option.

Have you read the forum guidelines for effective communication already?

I buied your course and beggined to follow your site because i wanna know how  to manipulate and make people dependent of me.But through this annalisis and the course i see that this way is not so rewarding as i think.I learned its much better if you pull prople up in the same time you pull you up.Great annalises BTW (i learned this innitials in your course?).I advise ignore if have mistakes,i am from Brasil and its probably the second time i write in english.?

Quote from naathh12@gmail.com on December 6, 2020, 12:49 pm

I bought your course and began follow your site because i wanna know how  to manipulate and make people dependent of me.But through this analysis and the course i see that this way is not so rewarding as i think. I learned its much better if you pull prople up in the same time you pull you up. Great annalises BTW (i learned this innitials in your course?).

BOOM!

Very happy to read this.
That's some tectonic-level, life-changing mindset upgrade you've just gone through.

Congrats to you, Naath!

Have you read the forum guidelines for effective communication already?

"Bocca di Rosa" - Fabrizio de Andre'

Key Takeaways:

  • "Loose" women disempower other women
  • Women sleeping around make female enemies
  • Attractive women can attract female jealousy (more so than attractive men among men)
  • What makes you high power can easily make you disliked by those who are low power (one of the reasons why high-power/high-warmth and collaborative frames are a helpful tool to keep your enemies low in number)

LYRICS

I translate it as best as I can (difficult to translate work of art):

They called her rose mouth
She put love, she put love
They called her rose mouth
Se put love above everything

As soon as she got off at the station
In the village of Sant'Ilario
Everyone noticed with a look
That she was not a missionary

There are those who love out of boredom
Those who choose it as a profession
Rose mouth neither,
She did it out of passion

But passion often leads
To satisfy your cravings
Without investigating whether the lover
He has a free heart or he has a wife

And so it was that suddenly
Rose mouth attracted on herself
The fatal wrath of the little bitches
She had stolen the bone from

But village wives
They certainly do not shine in initiative
The countermeasures up to that point
They were limited to cursing her

It is known that people give good advice
Feeling like Jesus in the temple
It is known that people give good advice
If they can no longer set the bad example

So an old woman who was never a wife
Without ever children, without more cravings
She took the trouble and certainly the pleasure
To give everyone the right advice

And turning to the cuckolds
She addressed them with witty words
"The theft of love will be punished"
She said "by the established order"

And they went to the inspector
And they said without paraphrasing
"The lousy one already has too many customers
More than a grocery store

And four gendarmes arrived
With the plumes, with the plumes
And four gendarmes arrived
With plumes and with weapons

Often the cops and the carabinieri
They fail in their duty
But not when I'm high ranks
And they accompanied her to the first train

Everyone was at the station
From the commissioner to the sacristan
Everyone was at the station
With red eyes and hat in hand

To greet her who for a while
Unpretentious, unpretentious
To greet her who for a while
She who brought love to the village

There was a yellow sign
With black lettering
It said "goodbye rose mouth
Spring leaves with you

But a bit of original news
It doesn't need any newspaper
Like an arrow from the bow it shoots
Fly fast from mouth to mouth

And at the next station
A lot more people than when she left
Who blew a kiss, who threw a flower
Who books for two hours

Even the parish priest who does not despise
Between a miserere and an extreme unction
The ephemeral good of beauty
He wants her next in procession

And with the Virgin in the front row
And pink mouth not far away
He brings along the village
Sacred love and profane love

KEY PASSAGES

Rose mouth attracted on herself
The fatal wrath of the little bitches
She had stolen the bone from

Attractive women are competition for other women.

And sexually "easy" women disempower other women in the sexual marketplace, making it harder for everyone else to get a man to court, chase, and invest.
In a way, sleeping easily is a "defection" that a woman commits towards all other women, since in sexual marketplace in which no woman ever slept around, then all women would have far more dating power.

Now picture an attractive woman, sexually "easy", who asks for nothing back, and who sleeps with taken men alike... And you get an explosive cocktail.

Of course, also keep in mind this is a ballad and somewhat of a male fantasy. On average people who have a lot to give demand more, not less. So in-demand women also demand more investment for sexual access (some exceptions might apply).

The countermeasures up to that point
They were limited to cursing her

This whole song reminds me of the movie Malena.

And what a better actress for "mouth of rose" than Monica Bellucci

"Limited to cursing" shouldn't be taken lightly though, since low-level aggression can be a red flag for something bigger brewing.

It is known that people give good advice
Feeling like Jesus in the temple
It is known that people give good advice
If they can no longer set the bad example

Absolutely one of my favorite lyrics ever.

I found myself quoting it, sometimes to myself, more than once (and I think quoted it on some articles here as well).

Very important concept in power dynamics as well.
Some of the headwind, hate, and pushback you receive in the form of "moralization" is from people who are not being moral, but self-interested and/or jealous.

A dynamic that overlaps and can be confused with virtue signaling / SJW, but it's different.
Virtue signaling says "look at me, I'm prosocial/good", while this one says "you're disempowering me and my (sexual) options, and making me feel inferior, so I must stop you in the name of morals".
Sometimes the two go hand in hand, but not always, it's two distinct concepts.

Of course, keep in mind the power moves rule: don't over-generalize. It's not always the case that someone making moral considerations has second motives.
But it's a component of human nature worth keeping in mind.
And it's also one of the reasons why when you give advice concerning morality you must take precautionary steps to make it clear you're not being jealous or self-interested (very advanced social skills).

And with the Virgin in the front row
And rose mouth not far away
He brings along the village
Sacred love and profane love

Apparent hypocrisy.

And another crucial law of power dynamics: when you're very high value, some people are happy to "forget" about your other faults.
And if you hide your other faults, or pretend not to have them, then people are all the happier to forget them.

That's how the church has sometimes cozied up with the mafia: mafiosi pretend to be religious and conservative, they're wealthy and high-power... And some priests are happy to "forget" the truth (same for the general public, who harbors a secret admiration for high-power folks, even when amoral).

And same for "rose mouth" here: her attractiveness is value, and the priest is happy to "forget" that she breaks the Christian sexual "values".

Have you read the forum guidelines for effective communication already?

This reminds me of a video I watched.

This woman is very assertive and open about her desire to have a lot of sexual experiences.
In some ways like the main character acted by Monica Belluci in the movie Malena.
She does come across as warm and friendly, so that will prevent a lot of frenemies/enemies.

Lucio: And it's also one of the reasons why when you give advice concerning morality you must take precautionary steps to make it clear you're not being jealous or self-interested (very advanced social skills).

This is fascinating.
We discuss quite a bit about ethics and values on this forum. (Okay maybe a few of us : )
I suppose one way to show non-jealousy and non-self-interest would be to provide more sides of the coin.
Don't sound like a loud-mouth virtue-signaller who only espouses the benefits of a particular moral stance.

A dynamic that overlaps and can be confused with virtue signaling / SJW, but it's different.
Virtue signaling says "look at me, I'm prosocial/good", while this one says "you're disempowering me and my (sexual) options, and making me feel inferior, so I must stop you in the name of morals".
Sometimes the two go hand in hand, but not always, it's two distinct concepts.

Would saying black people needing support be the former (virtue signalling) or the latter (you're disempowering me and making me feel inferior)?
I'm thinking that it is the former.
Because white people don't feel inferior to black people.

Virtue signalling is that the aggressor disempowers others by raising his status through espousing moral values.
The latter is more defensive.
The aggressor shames the other by moral values to avoid the other from disempowering her.

This woman is very assertive and open about her desire to have a lot of sexual experiences.
In some ways like the main character acted by Monica Belluci in the movie Malena.
She does come across as warm and friendly, so that will prevent a lot of frenemies/enemies.

Yeah, and on top of the high-warmth, the fact that she calls herself slut -at least in the book name- also makes it more difficult to attack / ostracize her.

It's a good (pre-emptive) power move, also against judges: you "own" your "badness", publicly, which can make the attacks more difficult -albeit not impossible, one could double down on it with "she's a slut... And she's even proud about it! Such a disgusting woman".

But women are less bothered by women who are open about their "looseness".
Open sluts are not nearly as dangerous to other women for long-term dating and male investment because men don't usually want to invest in those women -and the long-term mode is the most important battleground for women-.
So they're actually lower competition.

It's the women who act pious but then sleep with the guy early and make it seem like an exception that are far more dangerous.

Edit: check out here for the virtue signaling.

Have you read the forum guidelines for effective communication already?
12